The official Apple iPad thread

[NicolaUK]

Originally Posted by mbuckhurst

Do you have kids? I wouldn't trust mine with a £200 netbook let alone a £500 piece of glass.

No I don't have kids, not sure of the relevance of that though, but I do know that loads of secondary age teens now have laptops - I wasn't referring to little kids, obviously.

I'd like to think that anyone that bought one of these for somebody else would buy it knowing it would be respected but shame on me for bringing logic in to the equation.

[Tempest]

If the UK price is right I can easy see myself getting one of the lower models just for WiFi around the house, movie in bed etc.....

[mbuckhurst]

Originally Posted by ianmb

There's must also be a lot of potential business use for the iPad from mobile email checking and slideshows to use in the health sector. It all needs time and development.

Apple have not created a product to fill a need. They've created a product which will create a need.

The iPad is too expensive, fullstop.

Apple have made a big mistake (imho although I'll probably be proved wrong), they're trying to create a device with no definite market, it's limited and very expensive, but more importantly there are big players in this place who know how to do this stuff and more than likely can do it better and cheaper, for once I reckon Apple might lead the way, and get burnt doing it.

I'm sure there are plenty of people who could think of a good use for it, goodness knows I could, I bet a lot of the positive people here are amongst them, but they won't actually part with so much cash and buy this device, it's another Apple white elephant.

mike

[vulture]

It's always made me laugh when I hear Mac Fan Boys claim that the default single button mouse and applicate specific menu bar are intuitive.

Yeah, intuitive when apps didn't multi task. Look at the old RISCOS systems. 3 button mouse and intuitive.

[blazeuk]

Originally Posted by NicolaUK

I know so many parents that have bought laptops for their kids in the last 18 months or so. They use them for Facebook, iTunes, Bebo, MySpace, MSN etc. And then they get riddled with viruses - let's see how 'budget' laptop sales fall in the next 18 months as this is the device that does everything the casual computer user needs.

I think one of the problems with that type of use is that alot of people do browse the internet whilst talking on the likes of MSN at the same time - with the lack of multitasking, thats not going to be possible, its either one or the other (also, is facebook chat flash based? so that wouldnt work...maybe with the seperate facebook app, but again that means you cant browse the internet at the same time).

I think alot of people who buy them will probably enjoy them, but eventually once the new feeling wears off, they'll find them to be frustrating because of the limitations.

[Tempest]

Originally Posted by mbuckhurst

The iPad is too expensive, fullstop.

Apple have made a big mistake (imho although I'll probably be proved wrong), they're trying to create a device with no definite market, it's limited and very expensive, but more importantly there are big players in this place who know how to do this stuff and more than likely can do it better and cheaper, for once I reckon Apple might lead the way, and get burnt doing it.

I'm sure there are plenty of people who could think of a good use for it, goodness knows I could, I bet a lot of the positive people here are amongst them, but they won't actually part with so much cash and buy this device, it's another Apple white elephant.

mike

Just a thought.

Do you think there might just be a mass of people (just in the UK) that would like to perhaps do email, or look up a web site, or look at some photo's etc, but are just not "into" computers, perhaps feel intimidated by them etc?

Only recently there was that talk about the VERY simplified Linux front end machine (overpriced) for elderly people who had never touched a computer before.

I could see people like this loving something as restrictive (if you wish to use that term) as the iPad.

It's kinda like the people who walk into Woolworths (in the past) or argos and just bought the cheapest TV that worked but we would run a thousand miles from, as they are just not interested in it as such, they just want something that does the job.

Perhaps Apple need a bigger market for this to survive, but I'm certain if it was pushed into the right areas, the iPad could be a great device for people who just wanted to do the minimum (email and look up some web sites ets, and or diary/phonebook) but really are not interested in anything more than that.

Just a thought

[mbuckhurst]

Originally Posted by Tempest

Just a thought.

Do you think there might just be a mass of people (just in the UK) that would like to perhaps do email, or look up a web site, or look at some photo's etc, but are just not "into" computers, perhaps feel intimidated by them etc?

Only recently there was that talk about the VERY simplified Linux front end machine (overpriced) for elderly people who had never touched a computer before.

Perhaps Apple need a bigger market for this to survive, but I'm certain if it was pushed into the right areas, the iPad could be a great device for people who just wanted to do the minimum (email and look up some web sites ets, and or diary/phonebook) but really are not interested in anything more than that.

Just a thought

61% of households had then internet in 2007, which I'm guessing back then = PC users for 99% whether mac, pc or other.

I'd imagine these days there are fewer and fewer people who haven't 'grown' up with computers, and I think it's a big disservice to the elderly to suggest they would cope better with an iPad, most elderly people I know use the internet on a daily basis on computeres.

It's going to cost £500+ most people will take one look at it in currys, exclaim how lovely it looks and wouldn't it be good for this or that, and then buy the machine next to this with a keyboard, higher resolution, multi-tasking and a camera, for not much more than the vat on the pad.

mike

[Tempest]

Not saying the numbers are wrong, but Internet in the household, does not actually mean everyone in that household is computer savy.

I was thinking of this:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8352606.stm

She said she was shocked by the number of older people who do not have computers - a survey by the Office for National Statistics in August 2009 revealed that 6.4 million people over 65 have never used the internet.

I know the iPad is not really being focussed in this area yet, but I'd imagine it would be easier to use than most other devices for this group of people.

[NicolaUK]

Originally Posted by mbuckhurst

most elderly people I know use the internet on a daily basis on computeres.

If you are offering that as a serious statement I think you are most certainly in a minority.

[stu_69]

Originally Posted by Tempest

Not saying the numbers are wrong, but Internet in the household, does not actually mean everyone in that household is computer savy.

I was thinking of this:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8352606.stm

She said she was shocked by the number of older people who do not have computers - a survey by the Office for National Statistics in August 2009 revealed that 6.4 million people over 65 have never used the internet.

I know the iPad is not really being focussed in this area yet, but I'd imagine it would be easier to use than most other devices for this group of people.

Seriously do you work for Apple?

Have you been left alone with the computer for longer than is allowed today?

Are you going to buy one? Why are you having some sort of bi-polar conversation with yourself? One minute it's ****, then you have to have it, then it's not "HD", next it's "I don't own anything made by Apple, why am I in here".

You sir are a mental.

I've decided I am getting one but not till next year should have ironed out all the niggles by then and I don't want to be seen without my must have ipad v3.9.

[Cockeye]

Right, having had over 24 hours to think about it I'm gonna jump in again.

I think this is a great device. Yes it could be better, but we knew that Apple would miss something out (as they did on the first iPhone) in order to launch at a reasonable price (and I think it IS a reasonable price).

To me, I have already mentioned the chance of downloading newspapers, and eventually when books become reasonably priced, them as well. At the moment I am reading Stephen King's "Under the Dome" but can't take it to work due to the huge size of it. Downloading the ebook absolutely makes sense. I don't think that ebooks are the killer app yet, for reasons I am not going to go into here, but they COULD be.

When I am in the home, I find it a much more pleasant experience surfing the net on my iPhone when comfortable on my sofa than I do on my laptop, at the table, on an uncomfortable chair. In fact, I probably browse as much on my iPhone as I do on my laptop. email is 100% on the iPhone, and so is Twitter. facebook is about 80% iPhone, 20% laptop.

So to someone like me the cheap, low end version of this is a must have (if the price is right). I think it will marginalise my laptop almost completely, and that is a good thing.

As for the argument for older people I think that is 100% correct. My Dad is not great technically and has an aging desktop that is now struggling with XP, is very slow, and takes up a serious amount of real estate in a smal one bedroomed flat. There is NOTHING he uses his computer for that he couldn't do on an iPad and he could ditch the desktop. If I could afford it, I would buy him one.

I think people on here who hate it are not seeing the future potential of the product (as, to be fair, I was doing when iPhone 1 came out).

[statto]

Originally Posted by mbuckhurst

I'd imagine these days there are fewer and fewer people who haven't 'grown' up with computers, and I think it's a big disservice to the elderly to suggest they would cope better with an iPad, most elderly people I know use the internet on a daily basis on computeres.

As someone who teaches IT classes for beginners (the majority of whom are retired), I'd say you're way off with that assessment.

If the prices Tempest quoted earlier are right I could see a decent number of the lowest spec ones being bought as gifts for parents.

[xxx]

Originally Posted by *******

When I am in the home, I find it a much more pleasant experience surfing the net on my iPhone when comfortable on my sofa than I do on my laptop, at the table, on an uncomfortable chair.

Why don't you surf using your laptop on the sofa, with the laptop on your lap, as designed?

[KennyVader]

Just seems rather impractical to me the more I think about it. Sure it might be good for people that need a computer while they wander about a warehouse or shop floor, held and used clipboard-fashion, Star Trek / Avatar style short term "info board" etc; and I've no doubt we'll see lots of the likes of those numpties "in PR" that wander about organising people on the red carpet etc using ipads instead of the very important clipboards they use today.

Any other use, I just don't see it. The issue of the on-screen keyboard taking up half the precious 1024x768 pixels leaving not a lot of space to actually read the email you're composing has already been mentioned. How do you go through your email on it anyway? Pick it up, read an email, put it down on a table or lap in order to type a reply, then what, read the next email hunched over it on your lap or table in front of you, or pick it up again then put it down again to type a reply, pick it up again to read it at a sensible angle, put it down on the table or lap to type the next reply? Up --- down --- up --- down --- up --- down. If you're supposed to keep it in one hand all the time so you can read and type, read and type, without putting it down each time ... assuming it's not too heavy to irritate your arm doing that ... well that means you're left with only your one other hand to type with. Which nobody can argue is efficient, even the worst typists use one finger from each hand usually. Maybe you're supposed to write on it ... well if so why have all the mobile phones and pocket PCs and palms that used to be so keen to make people use on-screen handwriting recognition all but disappeared? It's not because the handwriting recognition was poor because on Windows Mobile it's been really accurate for years, it's just that it's actually faster to type.

Watching movies? At least a laptop screen comes with the ability to instantly put the screen at any comfortable angle built in. Lie down a bit more in bed or sit up a bit in your train seat ... just change the screen angle right away. Watching movies on the ipad is going to involve some elaborate multi-angle frame or stand, or haphazardly balancing the thing on a cushion or propped up against the yellow pages. I certainly don't remember ever desiring to watch my next movie hunched over a tray-like surface lying flat on my lap

Reading ebooks on the tube or in Starbucks? I get nervous enough with my Nintendo DS in my hand, fearing someone's going to grab it and run off at the next stop. You think I'm going to risk £600 of shiny shiny tablet on the Picadilly Line?

Now admittedly these issues affect ANY tablet not just the iPad. Essentially the whole idea of a tablet seems really niche market to me now.

[KennyVader]

Originally Posted by *******

When I am in the home, I find it a much more pleasant experience surfing the net on my iPhone when comfortable on my sofa than I do on my laptop, at the table, on an uncomfortable chair. In fact, I probably browse as much on my iPhone as I do on my laptop. email is 100% on the iPhone, and so is Twitter. facebook is about 80% iPhone, 20% laptop.

But if your browsing on the iPhone is so comfortable and more or less meets your needs currently, where's the need for the iPad? Is the screen resolution worth so much money?

Originally Posted by *******

As for the argument for older people I think that is 100% correct. My Dad is not great technically and has an aging desktop that is now struggling with XP, is very slow, and takes up a serious amount of real estate in a smal one bedroomed flat. There is NOTHING he uses his computer for that he couldn't do on an iPad and he could ditch the desktop. If I could afford it, I would buy him one.

So why not buy him a cheap £200 Acer running Win7 from Tesco? Of course the XP machine is large and slow, you say yourself it is aging. Why would you wait so long for an iPad to solve his problem, when the real solution is he just needs something up to date, both size and software wise, you could have fixed his issues several years ago, you didn't need a new tablet to do that.

[kiran_mk2]

First a confession - I've skipped about 15 pages of this thread from yesterday so sorry if I repeat some things.

Right then, the iPad. Personally I think it's an awesome idea - if you think back to the original, non-*******ised version of the netbook (The EEE PC 701), it was supposed to be a lightweight, small, cheap "computer" that stripped everything back and offered the modern core functionalities. These were perceived by Asus to be web, email, im, music/video and simple office functionality (so writing letters rather than a thesis). The small SSD kept the speed up and media could be saved to an SD card. To that end they provided a simple linux front-end with the advanced linux features hidden from users by default. Yes, you could install Windows and do anything a regular laptop could do, but let's be fair it blew. Ever tried gaming, photoshop or video encoding on a netbook? Somehow along the way, this message was lost. The move to 8.9" was sensible since the footprint was basically the same, but the more recent 10-12" netbooks have rammed in the extras. big hard drives, bluetooth, gpus and slipped Windows in there. This has resulted in the prices going up (where as the prices initially started heading to £200, they now seem to be £300-£400 for the latest models) and people seeming to expect them to do everything a regular laptop can. Windows doesn't help convince them otherwise, but I remember a lot of linux netbooks were returned by people who were confused by the whole linux interface.

Enter the iPad. To me it seems like Apple returned to the original idea of the netbook, but have the advantage of having a UI that a lot of people already know how to use. Again, the modern "core" uses of web, email, music/video, photos, basic office apps but added ebooks and gaming. Yes, it's the same as the iphone/ipod, but the increased size looks lovely and the videos make it look soooooo snappy. I think we're going to see some absolutely amazing apps for this thing.

In addition, it's running iPhoneOS 3.2 at the moment and I think we all know iPhoneOS 4.0 is likely to be unveiled next month and released in the summer so it seems likely the "core" functionality will improve then. The way they avoided talking about multitasking at all. makes me suspect this is something that's coming to to the iPhone/iPod/iPad in 4.0.

What I can't understand, is why so many corners have been cut. no front-facing camera for ichat is pretty shocking as it seemed like a no-brainer. I'm not sure what the point of the compass is with out a rear camera for augmented reality apps. The 4:3 screen, although good quality, should really have been 16:10 and as it is isn't even HD ready (only 1024 pixels rather than 1280). When it's being touted as a media tablet, it seems really strange that you can't stream media to it like an AppleTV - like and iPod it's sync or nothing. The lack of stereo speakers is also strange. Then there was the presentation - watching SJ surfing the web for about 10 minutes (when we all know how to use the UI as they've pointed out) - including websites showcasing the lack of Flash. The bland looking games, the repeated declaration that this was the most amazing device ever and the continued glowing throughout didn't help either.

All in all, I think it's a really good device, but the obvious hardware deficiencies (screen ratio/resolution, lack of cameras, mono speaker and "optional" 3G sim holder seem like they will inevitably be fixed in the next gen. The software may well improve in a matter of months, but as it stands, the iPad is something that nearly gets it right as a netbook replacement. If multitasking was there it would be (for me) the perfect netbook-style gadget and would definitely be something I'd investigate as 80% of what I use my MacBook for is web, email and videos. The other 20% is probably Photoshop and video encoding that I need a full spec computer for. Personally, I still think magazines and newspapers are done for due to the net, but I can see magazine subscriptions helping to sell these things too.

The price is typical Apple - likely to be £399, £499 and £599 for the 3 memory configurations with a surcharge of £100 for 3G. So it's about a £50-100 premium over a netbook which has an illusion of being a "full" computer.

Final judgement will be reserved for when we see the custom apps and what 4.0 brings.

[paulsaz]

they've left all the good stuff out to keep the price "down" (for apple). there is probably a big market for a really basic device like this. Unfortunately for apple this market will not pay apple prices and care not a jot for the "prestige" of owning apple. the asus rip off for £299 will fly out of dixons whilst the mac lovers bleat about how bleeding edge is giant ipod touch is.

[blazeuk]

Originally Posted by kiran_mk2

This has resulted in the prices going up (where as the prices initially started heading to £200, they now seem to be £300-£400 for the latest models) and people seeming to expect them to do everything a regular laptop can. Windows doesn't help convince them otherwise, but I remember a lot of linux netbooks were returned by people who were confused by the whole linux interface.

Enter the iPad. To me it seems like Apple returned to the original idea of the netbook, but have the advantage of having a UI that a lot of people already know how to use.

The original idea of the netbook was to be cheap as you say, so i dont see how the iPad returns to that idea, since its likely to come in around £429 for the basic model, it is infact just replicating the price of some of the high end netbooks available now (and mid ranged laptops can be bought for around this price).

I do think this could be made to be a useful product to have around the house, but it will always be a luxury product as its not going to replace whats already available (and it seems Apple have helped that by not particularly having an ideal OS for it and it lacking some vital features for it to be useful for more than the occasional browsing).

[kiran_mk2]

Well, I don't think it was ever going to be cheap, but it's returning to the original functionality of the netbook. I don't think these are going to appeal to those who already have laptops and probably not those with iphones - but those who are considering a "high end" netbook for the sofa or to take away with them on holiday/trips - typically, those with desktops or large laptops. And I'd definitely agree about a "locked" system being perfect for those who are new or not confident with computers as not only are the critical system files etc hidden, but the UI is intuitive (the number of times I've had to walk my mother through using basic Windows features)...

I still think this is just a part of their media strategy. If they released an itunes home server that held all this media and served out to AppleTVs, ipod/iphones, ipads and pcs/macs running itunes. A tv subscription plan which downloads episodes automatically. Items bought from any device will sync to the server and become available to all the devices. Things such as movies, tv, music (itunes), ebooks and magazines (ibooks), photos (iphoto) and apps (appstore) are then served out over the network to all devices with settings on what to sync and what to stream.

One step at a time I guess.

I wonder if Apple will update the UK iPod touch prices so they go £149 (8 gb), £199 (16 gb), £299 (32 gb), £399 (basic pad) etc.

[The Bear]

Dom Joly has reviewed it already:

http://www.funnyordie.co.uk/videos/d2b714361c/hello