[Blu Ray] Why does it never look as good as in the shop?? [Archive]

View Full Version : [Blu Ray] Why does it never look as good as in the shop??

ggrant

09-03-2010, 09:35

I have a PS3 (which I use for Blu Ray more than anything else) connected to my Panasonic G10 set to 1080p.

Now when I was in HMV at the weekend, they had a demo disc playing and the difference was definitely noticeable in picture quality. Now my question is, do certain brands of player/display just happen to work better with each other? ie a Sony Blu Ray player and a Sony TV? Are standalone players better at displaying content rather than playing it through a PS3?

There arent many other settings that I can tweak really other than gamma and contrast etc but I doubt they would have an impact on the level of detail that you can see on the screen.

Has anyone else ever been in this position?

scoobyood

09-03-2010, 10:01

So you are saying the shop had better quality than you have at home? I've never found that, shops always suck in blu-ray quality. So I'd say yours must be way off.

Sony TV and Sony blu-ray player etc combinations makes no difference and the PS3 is just as good if not better than most budget blu-ray players. Plus your G10 should be way better than the shop LCD's.

I can't see your screen obviously but there are a few basics. Turn off Colour Management, Eco Mode, P-NR (all noise reduction.. that just blurs detail out).. then turn the sharpness to zero. That's the important one. The sharpness just adds white lines around high contrast parts of the picture.. obliterating detail in-between.

If the contrast or gamma is too high it can make a big difference of the detail on screen. Gamma particularly, if set wrong, can cause posterisation which makes a nice picture look like an 8bit PC wallpaper.

Here is a completely free set of test patterns to set the gamma and contrast etc. There are also ones in there for sharpness etc.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=948496

I use this one... http://www.sendspace.com/file/osu8vq you just burn it to a DVD, it plays fine in my blu-ray player menus and all. You can also use the MP4 video files (no menus) on the main page if you don't want to burn a disc.

I use the "Near Black" video in the Colour HCFR menus to set black level. But there are PDF's guides in there to tell you what all the patterns after for. There are LOADS in there, but the basic settings and the 'misc patterns' one should cover pretty much all you need.

ggrant

09-03-2010, 10:12

scoobyood

09-03-2010, 10:24

Yeah you want to use the cinema or normal mode up for movies.. and use the game mode when you play a game. Which is annoying and you probably won't do it. But i'd recommend it.
Even though both might have exactly the same settings. The game mode will have less lag but it will probably be slightly "dynamic". That won't matter too much for games, but for movies it will dim the dark parts of the image when there are more bright parts than dark. They do that to bump up the "dynamic contrast" figures, but it sucks the "depth" out of the picture and screws up the colour reproduction... so they have a cinema mode which doesn't do that. Very complicated this calibration stuff :lol:

KRW

09-03-2010, 10:30

Yeah, I find mine looks way better than the shop ones. Practically identical set up as well. Turn all the enhancements off the G10, as above, and it should look much better than the shop ones.

LCD sometimes looks a lot brighter than plasma, so maybe thats it?

barrynorton

09-03-2010, 13:59

you also need to set the right output for the ps3
games should use rgb full for the best colour range on a modern tv
whilst video files, dvd and blu ray should be set to ouput in Pb/Cb Pr/Cr super white settings.

Ive set myLCD screen up with 2 settings, one for games which uses full rgb, and one for blu rays and dvds and video files which uses Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr super white settings

use the right one at the right time.

SheepDip

10-03-2010, 06:16

There's also the classic where shops usually have the contrast ramped up to maximum on their LCDs. Might look good and very vibrant for the minute at most you walk past that display, but you wouldn't want to be watching a movie at that level at home.
I've never seen a shop display which looks better than mine (Except for obviously high end screens which I don't have), more often than not, they're connected up by muppets without any idea.
I still remember the early days of widescreen crts and dvd where I'd be adjusting the settings in the dvd player displays in the chainstores so it looked half ok.......yes I was a megageek.

ohood

10-03-2010, 08:21

AKPiggott

10-03-2010, 09:24

thescrounger

10-03-2010, 09:36

Some blu-ray players allow you to sharpen the output (the PS3 doesn't), and while this isn't improving the picture, it can give the image a bit more punch. On the other hand you might just be seeing some sharpening setting on the TV that makes you think it's better. Of course it isn't really.

lsba02853

10-03-2010, 10:01

I bought my HDTV from Comet who seemed to think it was a great idea to show off HDTVs broadcasting a shared aerial with a Freeview signal... Blu-ray was limited to the supporting wall-sized plasmas in the back of the shop.

I once got kicked out of Comet.
The sales guy was comparing a Panny and a Samsung plasma to a potential customer. Unfortuantely the panny had an aerial plugged in and the samsung a blu-ray demo via HDMI. He was actually comparing them and telling Mr Customer that the samsung was better based on the pictures he could see.

Mr sales man walked away, I plugged in an HDMI to the panny, showed Mr Customer then told him to buy the panny from Richer sounds as it was £400 cheaper :thumbs:

Nick dVl

10-03-2010, 10:33

Mr sales man walked away, I plugged in an HDMI to the panny, showed Mr Customer then told him to buy the panny from Richer sounds as it was £400 cheaper :thumbs:
:lol: :notworthy

gobstopper

10-03-2010, 12:23

Yeah, I was in HMV at the weekend and it just looked so much better!

Upon thinking about it, I think the Plasma is set to game mode on the PS3 input, so that will most likely have a bearing on it as well. I'll have a look at the settings when I get home tonight and see what I can tinker with.

If you look at some of the G10-oriented posts on avforums.com you'll probably find some more accurate settings.

I'd go with:-
Cinema/warm & turn everything else (all enhancements) off. Setting the sharpness to zero for BR is another key thing I've read many times. I've only just got my own BR player, though as I have the V10 I've got the advantage of THX mode. But that's the only difference, I've followed the same advice for all the other settings.

As to why it looks so much better in the shops - I think as already mentioned, it has a lot to do with the fact that most use LCD screens and they ramp up the contrast. This adds too much blue to the whites which does give the passing viewer that 'wow' factor but would probably burn the image into your corneas if you were to sit through an entire film with those settings. The argument is that a plasma (such as your G10) gives a much more natural picture than that of an LCD - not wishing to turn this thread into a p*ssing contest - and sometimes this can be why you get home and are disappointed with your own picture quality.

There's an argument against changing your HDMI lead (a digital signal is a digital signal regardless of whether your are using a piece of wet string or a £100 lead), but for a fiver you might want to look at investing in one of these (http://www.thatcable.com/acatalog/info_best_HDMI_Cable_.html). They received a 5* review in What HiFi (http://www.whathifi.com/Review/ThatCable-HDMI/) towards the end of last year and are reckoned to be a considerable improvement over standard issue HDMI leads.

Edit - Just had a root around and found these (http://www.avforums.com/forums/plasma-tvs/1053095-panasonic-g10-optimal-settings-2.html#post10850922) setting posted by a G10 owner. Make a note of your own settings first and give them a try.

GlennSh

10-03-2010, 15:35

Interesting comments here. I also bough a G10 recently so will try these settings out myself when I get home. Thanks all :thumbs:

JonL

10-03-2010, 18:23

I tend to find HMV displays do indeed look very good but the Comet/Currys ones look complete cack. I'm guessing that in HMV etc, they actually have a nice man from Sony/Samsung etc come and install the display whereas in the electrical stores they have to rely on the work experience boys and their own part-time staff to do all the monkey work.

It is also possible that in Currys/Comet, they show a whole movie (usually an animation, funny that:suspect:), whereas HMV will usually show a demo disc, showing off the best looking moments from a range of movies, so your eyes cannot adjust to one style of image, because, along comes something else that is dynamically different and so has more impact.

Tob

10-03-2010, 19:19

ohood

11-03-2010, 08:30

I got burgled recently and my replacement TV arrived last week (a W5500 Sony Bravia), when I turned it on I was asked the question "is this TV for home or shop use?", so perhaps they have ultra high brightness/contrast settings for shop stuff to reign us in :suspect:
It may have been for demo mode, showing the difference between 60/100hz modes, etc. Our Samsung has demo and hotel modes on it.

gobstopper

12-03-2010, 12:02

KRW

12-03-2010, 12:20

That's interesting. I just turn it all the down on my G10, but I wonder if adding a notch or two would make any difference.

dco_chris

12-03-2010, 14:44

I got burgled recently and my replacement TV arrived last week (a W5500 Sony Bravia), when I turned it on I was asked the question "is this TV for home or shop use?", so perhaps they have ultra high brightness/contrast settings for shop stuff to reign us in :suspect:

Yes, TV's can have shop modes which set the display to retina burning levels.

Sprout Crumble

12-03-2010, 15:31

Which should be a lesson to those offered an ex-display panel.

DVDWotcha

15-03-2010, 10:03

Depends if you rate the G10. I don't. Shops will tend to display demo material which shows off the panel at it's best. At home your stuck with normal content which can show up deficiencies of the panel or the source material.

tizza

15-03-2010, 17:53

The videos that they show are superb examples of hi def. The models on the yatch in the bikinis, the two oriental girls playing the piano and violin etc and the jeep driving over the sand dunes.

Where can you get the demo discs like that?

nwgarratt

15-03-2010, 23:26

Where can you get the demo discs like that?

These can be downloaded.

http://www.demo-world.eu/trailers/high-definition-trailers.php

chris21

18-03-2010, 00:12

This may be of interest. While it comes from a V10, rather than G10, thread it does reveal something about the sharpness setting on these sets which I had clearly got wrong.

Panasonic response to query regarding 'sharpness' setting (http://www.avforums.com/forums/plasma-tvs/1154181-panasonic-th-p42v10-th-p50v10-owners-thread-part-4-a-65.html#post11732248)

As my nana would say "Well I'll be buggered"!

I always thought I was a smart arse for knowing that sharpness should be set to zero. Looks like in the case of my V10, I was wrong!

Thanks for the info.:)

Jimmyboy

20-03-2010, 15:20

then turn the sharpness to zero. That's the important one. The sharpness just adds white lines around high contrast parts of the picture.. obliterating detail in-between.

My understanding is that low sharpness softens the image so is better for low resolution sources which contain grain. The general rule is the better the image the more you can up the sharpness (although you don't want to go too high), or so I thought...

chris21

20-03-2010, 20:49

Well, I suppose that link shows that zero is still the best setting.

It's just that on the v10 zero is half way on the sharpness, where as most people naturally thought zero was er, zero.

Alan George

25-03-2010, 11:39

I'd have to agree with some other posters, the shops do rack the contrast levels right up ( mostly on LCD's), & choose the right film, like Toy Story, so it looks super sharp, almost 3D. I can't watch a film like that. my Panasonic Plasma has the contrast set a lot lower than that; I want the film looking something like it did at the cinema. So there's not a massive difference between SD & HD on a new movie, unless, a/ you have an LCD, where SD doesn't look as good as on a Plasma. & b/ you use a projector. Thems my controversial views!

GarethH

25-03-2010, 12:01

I think its the other way around, the shops usually use factory settings and they are poor.

LouBarlow

25-03-2010, 16:56

My understanding is that low sharpness softens the image so is better for low resolution sources which contain grain. The general rule is the better the image the more you can up the sharpness (although you don't want to go too high), or so I thought...

There is a specific calibration tool for setting sharpness. I've never compared my SD and HD test patterns, but I'd imagine it is still universal between the 2 as there will still come a point where the TV begins artificially sharpening, no matter what the quality of the source.