Humax 9300: How to get it to show 4:3 programs correctly?

[SimonI]

I was going to ask this on the Humax forums but they've been unable to send me an activation email, so I'll try here instead!

I have a Humax 9300 PVR connected to my TV via the HDMI; all works fine except when I watch 4:3 material (ie., Family Guy). No matter what I do, I cannot get it to pillar box the material correctly and the only way to get the aspect ratio right is to change the TV input setting - but I want to leave that on "Just Scan" (pixel mapping) and don't want to have to adjust this everytime.

The "Wide" button the Hummy remote doesn't seem to do anything. I'd have expected the unit to fit the 4:3 material inside a 16:9 frame when upscaling - that would be the sensible thing to do. Since the TV obviously knows when broadcast material is 4:3 and changes the display to fit, why can't the Humax?

Apart from this niggle, I have no complaints over this unit - it does everything else beautifully :thumbs:

[broadz]

The fact that you mentioned Just Scan suggests you may have a Samsung TV. If you do you won't get it to autoswitch via HDMI. It isn't capable of doing it. Don't blame your Humax - if you had an upscaling DVD player or a Sky HD box connected to it via HDMI you'd have exactly the same problem.

Some TVs will autoswitch when connection is via HDMI (Sony and Toshiba are the best two). Some won't. Some won't even let you manually switch to 4:3 when watching via HDMI (Philips). Just thank God you haven't got one of those.

[SimonI]

Thanks for the info; yes, it is a Samsung ;)

However, I don't really expect the telly to do the switching in this instance (I assumed that HDMI feeds would always "be" 16:9) - rather I am surprised that the Humax is not doing the pillarboxing itself. Perhaps I expect too much! I also have it routed via a DVD recorder by SCART and that doesn't autoswitch either - but that may be the DVD recorder?

[broadz]

No box will automatically add pillarboxes itself to its 4:3 output (except perhaps a Blu Ray player which can only be connected to a TV via HDMI) - as it would normally expect your TV to be able to detect the lack of widescreen signal and adjust accordingly. But, as Samsungs don't detect the lack of widescreen signal via HDMI input, that is why the TV doesn't shrink the picture down accordingly. Freeview boxes, Freesat boxes, Sky HD boxes all do the same thing. They output a 4:3 signal, but many TVs don't auto-detect the 4:3 input.

[Mr Nice]

No box will automatically add pillarboxes itself to its 4:3 output (except perhaps a Blu Ray player which can only be connected to a TV via HDMI) - as it would normally expect your TV to be able to detect the lack of widescreen signal and adjust accordingly.Actually, by the specs there no such thing as 4:3 at HD resolutions (a rule which as you note some tvs like Phillips enforce strictly). The upshot of that is that there is no option to signal the aspect ratio of HD resolutions over HDMI (the aspect ratio of standard def can be signalled though).
Hence there certainly are boxes out there which will pillar box 4:3 when upscaling if asked to do so. The V+ box in my front room for a start.

[SimonI]

The frustrating thing is that when the player starts playback of a 4:3 program, the screen is briefly at the correct AR before popping back out to wide - no idea if it is the Hummy or the telly that is doing that though.

I did think that HD was natively in 16:9 - which points to the Humax not doing it right, imo, not the telly doing it wrong. Oh well...

[broadz]

Yes, but HDMI doesn't only carry high definition - as you have noticed by using a Humax PVR connected via HDMI to your TV, when there is no high definition signal to be transferred. Unfortunately some TVs expect HDMI to only carry high definition, so they auto stretch everything (by default) to 16:9 - and it is up to you to manually set it back to 4:3 as the TV doesn't realise that it is receiving a standard definition 4:3 transmission.

[SimonI]

I see what you mean, but the Humax is sending a high def signal to the telly (720p) when it's showing Freeview and playing back recordings.

[SimonI]

Not really got anywhere with this but came across a funny thing the other day - I was watching one of the BBC4 Beatles docs, one of those from the 60s in b&w 4:3; I couldn't be bothered changing the AR so it was stretched (:gag:). Halfway through a song I noticed it had switched to 4:3, then moments later popped back out. Thinking I'd imagined it I rewound it and tried again - same thing! So it seems there is an occasional 4:3 flag in the video stream somewhere. Pah!