View Full Version : Should Buffy end?
Davester
18-02-2002, 16:17
I have been watching some of my old buffy episodes on dvd (got them cheap - thanks guys!!) and was thinking how the show has declined IMHO (although Angel is great!!), and was thinking isn't about time they ended it. Go out at teh top and all that (as the show is starting to loose viewers), and not go on too long like the x files for instance.
Someone will probably correct me on this, but Yes. The show seems to be losing direction at present, although it could be very, very slowly leading up to something.......it used to be about a girl fighting vampires with the underlying metaphors etc, but now it's just turned into another Dawson's "let's cover every teen problem going" Creek sort of thing with a minimal amount of fighting...........even the "baddies" don't seem to bother doing too much now either......they vanish for episodes whilst a emotional problem is being dealt with, return to do very little and so on.....
Could do with some new characters IMO.
Also some decent villains.
Those 3 geeks are a joke
I thought it was losing it's way in series 4 - I didn't like Riley, the Initiative was a dumb idea and the villain was a joke, but series 5 was great and so far series 6 (of which I've seen the first 13 episodes) has been a delight. It's still way better than Stargate, Alias, Enterprise, Dark Angel, Roswell or Smallville and I don't hear anyone calling for them to be axed...
It should of ended at the end of season 5, after the big incident, it would of been so perfect.
the big incident
bufy dies
A great way to end the series, but instead they just carry on like nothing has happened by bringing her back from the dead. Then I think it would of been regarded as the best fantasy tv series for a very long time, possibly ever.
It does seem like it is now loosing direction.
Jimmyboy
18-02-2002, 17:11
Well Buffy is legally contracted until season 8 which is when it probably will end.
Unless the show gets axed.
Originally posted by jamesking420
It should of ended at the end of season 5, after the big incident, it would of been so perfect.
the big incident
bufy dies
A great way to end the series, but instead they just carry on like nothing has happened by bringing her back from the dead. Then I think it would of been regarded as the best fantasy tv series for a very long time, possibly ever.
It does seem like it is now loosing direction.
Keep watching, and remember, nothing happens without consequences....
Originally posted by Mr_Gimp
Keep watching, and remember, nothing happens without consequences....
That sounds interesting.... :)
mikegray
18-02-2002, 17:56
Can I just thank James for remembering the spoiler tag. So many people don't when discussing Buffy/Angel on the forums because they seem to assume everyone's already seen it. For me, I got into Buffy when I bought S1 on DVD and I've been going out of my way to avoid any spoilers that might ruin the surprises... the TV listings being my biggest curse!
mikegray
18-02-2002, 17:57
Originally posted by 8-]
That sounds interesting.... :)
Logically, I suppose what happens when [ABOVE SPOILER] happens will happen again, as it did in Seasons 2 & 3, no?
Originally posted by mikegray
Logically, I suppose what happens when [ABOVE SPOILER] happens will happen again, as it did in Seasons 2 & 3, no?
No, because :
One slayer is called for each individual slayer that dies, i.e. :
Buffy dies -> Kendra called
Kendra dies -> Faith called
Buffy dies again -> no-one called as she's already been "replaced"
So no new slayer until Faith dies, and she's in jail, for murder so it could be a while
This is the first time i've used spoiler tags, so let's hope they worked
scaramanga
18-02-2002, 18:38
Ive never watched buffy religiously but i recently bought the first series and thought it was amazing. Id forgotten how good the writing was and thats before spike etc have been introduced and developed properly! :D Cant really compare it to the newer series because i dont have sky and lost track of the storyline ages ago.
I would love to know why:
[1] The Initiative know all about demons, vampires etc but the residents of Sunnydale who are getting picked off regularly, demons trashing the town etc, NEVER seem to take any notice of this, or forget it within 5 minutes. Look at those demons that attacked Xander's workmates whilst Buffy was working on site.....5 secs later, "What demons?"
[2] Why doesn't a vampire, for example, just pick up a gun and shoot Buffy and Co.? In the first season, Darla had a gun, but every demon seems to want to go hand to hand with Buffy, and they always lose.......are they Dr. Evil fans or something???
[3] Why does it seem to take nearly 1/5 a season before anything major happens ie Glory doesn't appear for a few episodes ie something emotional occurs, and the main baddie thinks "I'll take a week off as taking over the world and killing everyone including the Slayer can always wait another week or two even though I'm completely desperate to do so! "; S6 - leading up to something, but after 5-6 episodes still nothing major, and you're probably guaranteed that at least 1/2 the remaining episodes have very little of the major threat in, who will wander around doing nothing till the last episode....
[4] Why hasn't Xander got blonde hair? Looking at cast pics, they nearly all seem to have bleached/blonde hair now.....
[5] I'm assuming the death rate in Sunnydale must be close to zerop at present as the vampire population has dropped from loads down to pretty much zero judging by the number being slayed in the past couple of seasons.........considering they're supposed to be on the Hellmouth, we have more demonic activity here in Grimsby than there!
Xenole:
1. Because they don't want to accept it and so try and ignore it when they all something is wrong with their town - it is mentioned in the S3 ep Gingerbread Men
2. Because it goes against the Vampire Code - they like to do things with a bang
3. Because it would be boring or can make the season peak too early like Angel S2
4. Because it would look it was set in Sweden
5. Because Buffy is not killing them as much anymore since her reincarnation - she had lost the will to continue onwards
Hope these answers help! :D
I honestly can't believe the lack of scope in imagination that some of you guys have!
You seem to be saying that you'd rather have the same thing week in week out, than a tv show that actually tries different things and defies audience expectations.
Xenole says: "it used to be about a girl fighting vampires with the underlying metaphors etc, but now it's just turned into another Dawson's 'let's cover every teen problem going' Creek sort of thing with a minimal amount of fighting"
and I suppose being brought back from the dead against your will is very average "teen" problem is it?! Also, don't forget, they are not teens anymore!!!!
And as for underlying metaphors, well has anyone else considered that Buffy's readjustment to regular 'life' after 'death' is very similar to that faced by someone who is recovering from an complete emotional and/or nervous breakdown! Seeing what she had to face last year this wouldn't be unheard of! And her - let's face it - suicide (attempt) in this context seems totally understandable behaviour from an emotionally scared young woman whose entire world has been literally and figuratively ripped apart!
Basically, what I'm saying is that this show has a lot going on beneath the surface and it's a testement to the writing that it sustains this character interest throughout each season.
If all you want is mindless action every week, watch trash like "Dark Angel".
i've always thought Buffy was OK, nothing more, nothing less.
It's great to watch when there's nothing else on but i wouldn't go out of my way to see it.
The writing is good (and i'll easily admit it) but i just generally find the show to be far too Dawsons Creek like (as someone said before though thats a tad unfair as DC is TOTAL crap) for my taste.
OK i'll admit it, im totally driven by style, i want to see vampires being killed in a groovy way with lots of blood! :)
Bring on Blade 2!! :clap: :clap: :D
I'm not sure I really get all the Dawson's Creek comparisons, for me DC was always grossly overwritten, and the scripts, while often intelligent, sound like nothing I have ever heard coming out of a 16 (as they were in the first series) year-old's mouth.
Somehow, despite being set in a world where vampires and demons are real, Buffy's characters come across as a damn sight more believable (and funny). OK, sometimes they are a bit whingy, but there's almost always a comedy aside to lighten things up a bit.
Blade 2 should be great though, especially with Guillermo Del Toro at the helm. Haven't seen The Devil's Backbone yet, but Chronos was a top film...
Originally posted by Mr_Gimp
Blade 2 should be great though, especially with Guillermo Del Toro at the helm. Haven't seen The Devil's Backbone yet, but Chronos was a top film...
Yep im a big fan of GDT as well, i also cant wait for this film from the point of view that GDT said he wanted to go even more over the top with this than the original. ie loads more blood and gore :)
Short Answer : Yes Buffy should end ... Buffy almost seems a spoof or parody of itself these days season 1,2,3 Good 4,5 and half way thru 6 nothing special:eek:
fivebyfive
18-02-2002, 21:46
Originally posted by Richie
If all you want is mindless action every week, watch trash like "Dark Angel".
:mad: Dark angel is not trash, some of season 1 was a bit poor but season 2 is very good so far. Mutant X is trash tv
Sorry if this has been mentioned as I've just whizzed through the replys. Buffy strikes me as being the visual equivelant of bands like Hear Say , S Club 7 and the like. I.E it doesn't matter how shallow and shamelessley self indulgent it is if you throw a few good looking stars in it then it will rake in money off impressionable kids parents.:rolleyes: Which is the only intention the producers have.
Crap.
Chyna Tsui
18-02-2002, 22:18
Originally posted by chris21
Buffy strikes me as being the visual equivelant of bands like Hear Say , S Club 7 and the like. I.E it doesn't matter how shallow and shamelessley self indulgent it is if you throw a few good looking stars in it then it will rake in money off impressionable kids parents.:rolleyes: Which is the only intention the producers have.
Crap.
Hear'Say good looking? Are you sure about this?
Giles (anthony head) was on BBCs breakfast show this morning and I seem to recall he said something along the lines of "it's on for one more year".
But it was breakfast time, and I'm really bad in the mornings.
Maybe someone else who saw it can confirm it.
He also talked (again) about the Giles spinoff show, about how Joss Whedon took his A-Levels in England and has fond memories of watching the BBC from when he was a kid. Also talked about Joss really wants to do a BBC style (ie high production value drama) featuring Giles.
As much as I always start to feel that any series begins to outlive itself after a few series I always carry on watching them as do most people and that's why they carry on. I've felt that "friends" has been going down hill for the last couple of years though every now and then there are some really good bits.
Anyway all this said I still think that buffy still is interesting and I'd argue that it was better than Angel last season.
As for smallville I've just started watching a few episodes of this and I am starting to like it, I prefer it to the "New adventures of superman" even though you could just call it another teen superhero series. Never bothered with Dark Angel or Mutant X though or the new Alias as I need some time to watch films :)
And as for putting pretty people on tv and ripping people off, You could say that about most if not all tv shows. If they weren't then whoever was in charge would be fired and someone else'd brought in that would do.
Originally posted by mikegray
Can I just thank James for remembering the spoiler tag. So many people don't when discussing Buffy/Angel on the forums because they seem to assume everyone's already seen it. For me, I got into Buffy when I bought S1 on DVD and I've been going out of my way to avoid any spoilers that might ruin the surprises... the TV listings being my biggest curse!
I'm the man.:clap: :clap:
Made you look
Originally posted by Andy_C
Giles (anthony head) was on BBCs breakfast show this morning and I seem to recall he said something along the lines of "it's on for one more year".
He also talked (again) about the Giles spinoff show, about how Joss Whedon took his A-Levels in England and has fond memories of watching the BBC from when he was a kid. Also talked about Joss really wants to do a BBC style (ie high production value drama) featuring Giles.
He was also on Johnny Vaughan last week saying pretty much the same thing - not so much about Buffy's last year, but deffo about the spin-off series 'The Watcher' based and filmed in the UK. Sounds interesting, although there's a nagging thought that this might be one spin-off too many.....
Personally I think that Buffy so far this season (On Sky that is) has been very good, better then the start of last season, and season 4. If it keeps up the level it is showing so far it should be a great season and I would be happy for an 8th season. That should/would probably be the last though.
Season 1-3 were perhaps the best so far, 4 I do actually like, though there are some of the worst episodes in it, and the whole Riley/Initiative was quite boring. Season 5 was better but and this season is again a step in the right direction.
Angel has got better and better though, forgetting the awful last few episodes of Season 2. The beginning of that season was great and as good if not better than Buffy that season. And so far Season 3 has been ever better.
Just my thoughts.
Cornelius
19-02-2002, 15:48
Is this programme a musical? can't say I've ever watched it but caught some of it last week and there was the main character doing a very very bad song and dance routine. It was a like a very bad episode of Ally McBeal. This sarah geller woman is almost as bad a dancer as that girl who plays Sabrina the Teenage Witch.
Doesn't look like it's a show worth bothering with.
Originally posted by Cornelius
Is this programme a musical? can't say I've ever watched it but caught some of it last week and there was the main character doing a very very bad song and dance routine. It was a like a very bad episode of Ally McBeal. This sarah geller woman is almost as bad a dancer as that girl who plays Sabrina the Teenage Witch.
Doesn't look like it's a show worth bothering with.
Last weeks was a musical episode, it was a one off though.
carrott_girl
19-02-2002, 16:27
I have mixed views on this. I'll put them all in a spoiler tag incase anyone moans at me.
At the end of the 4th Season I thought that it could only get better. After the brilliance which was S3, S4 was a serious let down. That last episode of S4 was good though and the things that Tara said made me want S5 to start. When Buffy's mum died I wanted the show to end because I didn't think that the show could go on, how the hell could Buffy afford that house and if they moved in with Giles then that would be tacky. I kept on watching but when Buffy died I wanted it to end. I had no idea where Joss could take the show without it being cheesy.
S6: I thought that the 1st two eps were very disappointing. The whole, Buffy is brought back to life was tacky and too easy. The 3rd episode made it for me though and all of my faith was put back into Joss. The fact that she was in heaven was a good twist. For those of you who haven't seen past Tabula Rasa you may want to miss this bit out: the fact that she's not quite human is great as well. I have no idea where Joss is taking this but I can't wait to find out.
SMG is contracted for another season, as is Joss, but Fox have the rights to the show and can carry on for as long as they like. I personally think that Buffy should end after 7 seasons.
What the show needs is more singing and dancing !!
Bring it on.
Originally posted by Grumpy
What the show needs is more singing and dancing !!
Bring it on.
just like the star wars holiday special, but with buffy, GENIUS idea! They could break into song every few mins!:D
Originally posted by kat23
Last weeks was a musical episode, it was a one off though.
Well I watched it on Thursday and the Saturday repeat, and felt overall it was very well done. Sure some of the lyrics and singing wasn't stage material/quality, but not as bad as it could have been.
One thing I really wanted more of in that episode rather than followed up later was the bit regarding the whereabouts of Buffy after she died in her final big song and dance number. Oh well, sure this weeks episode will get further into it.
just scanned the thread so apologies if this has been said. It's generally believed Buffy will finish at the end of season 7 when Geller's contract runs out, she wants to run off and have a crappy film career instead, although she may stick around if the money's right. it's also been reported that Joss + Marti of Buffy fame are making ANOTHER spin off show for FOX this summer (saw this on AICN) so hopefully we'll see Dawn the Vampire Slayer :nuts:
Personally I think season 6 is good, i've seen all 14 eps and they're very good IMO. the lack of a big bad is a bit strange, but when all the other things are going on it's not a major sticking point for me. although i have to say the spike/buffy sex actually shocks me, it's just too explicit. it seems like they're doing it for the sake of it. hopefully they'll get his chip out and all hell'll break loose!
doh i did repeat, just sawed carrott_girl's post, sorry!!
Space Duck
20-02-2002, 19:57
As for buffy ending HELL NO.... yes season 6 was poor to begin with but episodes like 'All The Way' and 'Once More, With Feeling' have renewed my faith in the show...
Everything in the Buffyverse happens for a reason... things that are said can refer to upcoming stories in season 6... for example when Faith entered buffys dream in Graduation Day and This Years Girls... quotes in that episode referred to characters in season 5 and may even spin out into season 6...
I can't wait to see what Joss thinks up next... he is god and he will end the show when he feels it's said all that needs to be said...
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