Poor picture through HDMI?

[Ballgirl]

I got my first HD TV yesterday. Hannspree YT08-37E1-000G

I connected to V+ to the new TV by HDMI and found that the picture was extremely pixellated, even on BBC HD and On Demand HD content. Noticable from a distance.

I've connected the V+ by Component and the picture seems a lot better from a distance but when I'm upclose the picture doesnt look that great. Is this normal?

Do you think my HDMI cable might be dodgy? Or the V+ box? Or is it my new TV?

[Napoleon]

Obviously i don't know what your televsion is like,but you should not assume that an HDMI connection is superior.It is fashionable for the internet folk to laud the 'all-digital' connection but it is not necessarily true.A component or RGB connection can be superior,it all depends on your system,tv etc.If the picture is fine from a normal viewing distance with component then i would just accept that,and not worry about the HDMI.If you can borrow an HDMI cable to test the best option for your set-up that would be a bonus.

[thescrounger]

Is this normal?



I don't think it is normal, no.


Do you think my HDMI cable might be dodgy? Or the V+ box? Or is it my new TV?

It could be any of those things.

[darrenthebear]

Do you have any other HDMI equipped electronics to test out on it? (PS3, upscaling DVD player etc)

[Ballgirl]

I've tried an upscaling dvd player and that looks good with the hdmi lead.

Also I've been out and got a new hdmi which seems to have helped if I use it with V+ box but I think i'm going to carry on using component as the blacks look better.

[DeadKenny]

Obviously i don't know what your televsion is like,but you should not assume that an HDMI connection is superior.It is fashionable for the internet folk to laud the 'all-digital' connection but it is not necessarily true.A component or RGB connection can be superior,it all depends on your system,tv etc.If the picture is fine from a normal viewing distance with component then i would just accept that,and not worry about the HDMI.If you can borrow an HDMI cable to test the best option for your set-up that would be a bonus.
An HDMI connection should be superior to analogue ones if you are getting a 1:1 digital mapping between input pixels and output pixels.

The only way to achieve this is if the source is exactly the same resolution as the display. Anything else will result in upscaling or downscaling.

Though you also need a display that will do exact 1:1 as many will by default overscan the picture like CRTs do. This overscanning involves scaling also.

Analogue inputs including component and RGB will undergo analogue to digital conversions and likely some scaling as it's unlikely they will be exactly the right resolution. VGA is about the nearest analogue signal you can get to HDMI as it's pretty much spot on in resolution (assuming you use the right resolution for the display).

In terms of cables, HDMI is simply just a digital connector. Quality of the cables is pretty much meaningless when it comes to picture, just the same as quality of an Ethernet network cable makes no difference to the quality of the files that are sent over the network.

Remember too though that HDMI gives you an exact picture (assuming the above 1:1 matching), and this may require different settings on your display. Normally we adjust our displays to compensate for the inadequacies of low resolution SD and analogue connections.

Another thing is analogue connections may in fact be inaccurate enough to blend out the defects you get in SD material such as DVD. Kind of like blurring to hide the artefacts.

Ballgirl - if you hooked up a true HD source to your TV by HDMI you'll likely be blown away.

[Ballgirl]

Is V+ BBC HD not a true source?

[DeadKenny]

Ah, I missed that. I don't even know what V+ is. Is that Virgin's thing?

Yeah, if the box is HD, you're watching an HD channel and connecting by HDMI then it should look great. Should be better still if the display is does 1:1 mapping, but not all do or you need to use an option in the menus or in some cases get the display firmware updated.

That said I've no idea of the quality of V+ HD.

[fothy123]

V+ HD and the BBC HD channel should look very clear and sharp.

[Refrenz]

I got my first HD TV yesterday. Hannspree YT08-37E1-000G

I connected to V+ to the new TV by HDMI and found that the picture was extremely pixellated, even on BBC HD and On Demand HD content. Noticable from a distance.

I've connected the V+ by Component and the picture seems a lot better from a distance but when I'm upclose the picture doesnt look that great. Is this normal?

Do you think my HDMI cable might be dodgy? Or the V+ box? Or is it my new TV?

I bought this tv last week - just a thought - what sharpness setting are you using on the TV? I have my DVD player hooked up via HDMI and found with sharpness set to 5 (maximum) the picture was pixelated, but with sharpness set below 5, the picture was much better. In my experience setting sharpness to 2 for all inputs works well.

[Ballgirl]

I bought this tv last week - just a thought - what sharpness setting are you using on the TV? I have my DVD player hooked up via HDMI and found with sharpness set to 5 (maximum) the picture was pixelated, but with sharpness set below 5, the picture was much better. In my experience setting sharpness to 2 for all inputs works well.

Thanks for your help. Out of interest, how have you set up the other options (Brightness, Contrast and Colour)?

[Refrenz]

Thanks for your help. Out of interest, how have you set up the other options (Brightness, Contrast and Colour)?

It varies depending on which input I am using and the lighting conditions in the room. For my DVD player via HDMI, if the lights are off in the room I turn the backlight setting (in system/system submenu) to 4 or 0, and the picture brightness up to 70. In a lit room the backlight is set at 12 or 16 with picture brightness set at 40 or 50. In all cases, contrast is usually set at 30, colour 24 to 26 and sharpness 2 or 4.

[ixi]

What output resolution have you set the V+ box to? 1080i? 720p?

[Ballgirl]

720p

[ixi]

do you get the same problem at 1080? I'm using a V+ into a Panasonic PX70 and HD is fantastic, that's at 720p. Do sometimes get pixellation, but assumed that was just signal issues, they don't happen requently though.

[Refrenz]

Just an update with my experiences of using this TV as far as picture quality goes. All is fine with it except HDMI at 1080i at 50Hz. The picture scaling at 1080i 50Hz is terrible. I thought the problem was with my DVD player as reported in this thread ...

http://www.thedvdforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7301250#post7301250

but no, the same picture scaling problem is occuring with my PC at 1080i 50Hz via HDMI as well, so its definitely the TV doing a cack job showing 1080i 50Hz. Here's the problem in visual form ...

720p 50Hz ... fine.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v407/Refrenz/YT08-720p-Not-Jagged.jpg

1080i 50Hz ... jagged edges.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v407/Refrenz/YT08-1080i-Jagged.jpg

[Refrenz]

Doh, dupe post.

[DeadKenny]

This TV is a 720p telly I believe. Could be an issue in the downscaling of a 1080i picture to fit.

Also being an interlaced signal you can get problems due to the nature of interlacing and the way the TV will de-interlace (as all LCDs will do as they are progressive by nature). Usually interlacing is more of an issue on motion though. Jagged edges is one of the artefacts though.

Usually there's advice that 720p is better for sports and 1080i for films. This is really just because 720p is progressive and removes the interlaced problems with fast motion, and 1080i is a higher resolution (though not relevant to 720 TVs). Though on a 1080 TV, 1080p is ideal in both situations, but broadcasters don't broadcast 1080p due to the bandwidth required so you only find it on HD-DVD/Blu-Ray. Again, not relevant to 720 TVs though).

If 1080i isn't looking good then maybe just feed 720p into your TV at all times. On a 720 set 1080 is surely not going to be much of a benefit I'd have thought.

[Refrenz]

This TV is a 720p telly I believe. Could be an issue in the downscaling of a 1080i picture to fit.

Thats what I think - someone somewhere didn't implement decent 50Hz picture scaling.