View Full Version : Lost Season 3 Episode 17 Spoilers
another good ep.
didn't really advance the others arc at all, but had a lot of info on desmond and the way his flashbacks work.
ghost.ottercrab
19-04-2007, 12:39
Did you spot the photo on the monk's desk when Desmond handed over his uniform?
Wasnt that the old woman from Desmonds previous flashback episode? The one who seemed to know about his premonitions. The head monk did seem to make a point about Desmonds future outside.
I saw the photo but didn't see the woman, my screen was too small.
Great ep, I thought, always knew it wasn't going to be Penny, at one point I thought it was a dummy.
One theory I had, briefly, was the island was in a Truman-show style dome. But clearly Airplanes and helicopters wouldn't be able to get in. I just thought it explained everything including the sudden rain falls (automatic irrigation for the island's vegetation) and "Dharma" plane drops
That's the Brit chick from Las Vegas, right?
Another excellent episode but I'm still none the wiser... but that's fine! :D
sleepy67
19-04-2007, 15:07
Did you all catch the news? Bernards alive, Sawyer mentioned him. The book that the pilot was carrying is Catch 22 in Portugese.
PS Kate getting dressed :n0rty:
Quincunx
19-04-2007, 15:55
Bernards alive
http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/2764/balloongi0.gifhttp://img181.imageshack.us/img181/2764/balloongi0.gifhttp://img181.imageshack.us/img181/6337/party3oj9.gifhttp://img181.imageshack.us/img181/3477/partyrc5.gifhttp://img181.imageshack.us/img181/6337/party3oj9.gifhttp://img181.imageshack.us/img181/2764/balloongi0.gifhttp://img181.imageshack.us/img181/2764/balloongi0.gif
Did I take this the right way - it appears to me that the woman was sent by Penny after they found the magnetic disturbance at the end of last season?
unrealnils
19-04-2007, 16:10
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:lol:
Did I take this the right way - it appears to me that the woman was sent by Penny after they found the magnetic disturbance at the end of last season?
That's what most will assume. Whether that's true, god knows.
sleepy67
19-04-2007, 17:10
That's what most will assume. Whether that's true, god knows.Its seems a pretty good assumption though, the guys monitoring in the S2 finale were Portugese, the book strongly implies the pilot is Portugese, a personal photograph of Penny and Desmond, the fact that pilot recognised Desmond presumably from the photo. Doesn't appear to be much doubt that the pilot is working for Penny. Now helicopters don't have that great a range, google-fu suggests typical values of 600-900Km This would imply that Penny has a ship or a base on another Island within a few hundred miles.
Also the timeing fits as its about 3 weeks since the Desmond turned the key and Pennys team observed an anomaly.
Love the way Jack's blissfully ignoring Kate's pining looks...
Next week he'll tell her he's a breast man...
She'll be in Sawyers tent quicker than a flash...
The book that the pilot was carrying is Catch 22 in Portuguese.
I assumed it was catch22
At least we now know why he kept calling everyone "Brother", it wasn't a ridiculous affectation after all
That's what most will assume. Whether that's true, god knows.
That's what they want us to assume anyway. Like you say, it's just an assumption.
This would imply that Penny has a ship or a base on another Island within a few hundred miles.
Or they flew to somewhere a few hundred miles from the island and got a helicopter from there. It's pretty likely the island is within a few hundred miles of some other place. I don't think there's many places that are surrounded by hundreds of miles of ocean.
One thought occurred to me today, why on earth did they leave the others village and return to the beach? Wouldn't it have been wiser to move everyone to the place that has electricity and running water? :doh:
Also there might be a chance that parachute girl saw some lights as she was coming down that could lead them to the Others hideout
I'm begining to think we might meet Jacob in the finale and he'll be revealed to be Locke/Penny/Jack/Claire's dad
PS Kate getting dressed :n0rty:
Best. Episode. Ever. :luv: :D
Anyone else found it strange how the monk sounded so similar to Desmond? At least we know what all the "Brother" malarkey is about now.
Loved Hurley's "you could have given us a heads up for an umbrella, dude" line. Who want's to hazard a guess at the next way Charlie's meant to kick the bucket?
Building up to a nice finale now, just hope we're not disappointed.
KennyVader
19-04-2007, 18:46
So the island changed things when Desmond disrupted things by saving Charlie? If he had let Charlie die as the island told him too in the flashes, it might have been Penny in the jump suit?
Weird ep. Not as good as the previous big Demond ep. Also I didn't think Penny looked as nice in this one.
sleepy67
19-04-2007, 18:51
That's what they want us to assume anyway. Like you say, it's just an assumption.Assumption must be the most used word in any discussion about Lost.One thought occurred to me today, why on earth did they leave the others village and return to the beach? Wouldn't it have been wiser to move everyone to the place that has electricity and running water? :doh:Its annoying that the Losties haven't even given us a throwaway line as to why they aren't moving to Losteria Lane. Its not like its that difficult to invent reason as to why they wouldn't: Long walk through Smokies territory No access to the beach hence no fish Electricity is turned off at source Other cooties Others might come backI'm begining to think we might meet Jacob in the finale and he'll be revealed to be Locke/Penny/Jack/Claire's dadI think you might be rightEspecially as s3e22/23 are scheduled to be Jackbacks
robzinski
19-04-2007, 19:11
She'll be in Sawyers tent quicker than The Flash...
Ah, but would she be quicker than Superman? ;)
So the island changed things when Desmond disrupted things by saving Charlie? If he had let Charlie die as the island told him too in the flashes, it might have been Penny in the jump suit?
Weird ep. Not as good as the previous big Demond ep. Also I didn't think Penny looked as nice in this one.
I think your eyes were still seeing Kate getting dressed from earlier in the ep. :luv: I thought Penny looked a lot better at the end of the ep than she'd been before.
One issue I have is that Charlie was in the original flashback of them cutting down the parachuter, so he was supposed to be there when they got cut down.
Another pointless flashback apart from the creepy woman in the picture & it explaining Desmond's "Brother" affliction. It would have earned bonus points if the monks were bottling Buckfast. :D
Otherwise, it was an ok episode, although everything after Kate's knicker-flash is a blur. :n0rty:
cockbongo
19-04-2007, 19:26
I immediately thought (and hoped) the monks were bottling dodgy tonic wine as well. Despite some *terrible* scottish accents it was good to see they did their scottish research - the street where Desmond's ex lived did actually look like any old Scottish town (although clearly CSO'd in) and they got their football songs right! Can you imagine the controversy if they'd accidentally had Desmond singing "Follow, Follow"??
BlueDwarf
19-04-2007, 19:31
What they get wrong with the stuff set in UK is the lighting. Far more believable if it was overcast rather than glorious sunshine - especially in Scotland!
Liked this ep a lot - glad to see they're finally following up the 'Penny searching for the island' subplot. I really have to add another :n0rty: for Kate too. :D
I thought his ex fiancée sounded Irish?
I dont get the helicopter. As has been mentioned they dont have a very long range and I cant believe that they are so near another settled island. The pacific is absolutely vast and a small island could be thousans of miles from anything else.
I cant wait to see how/if they explain this. I bet it will be that it wasnt actually a helicopter as we never see it.
KennyVader
19-04-2007, 20:01
Thw woman's clothing suggested she'd jumped out of some sort of fighter jet or high altitude/speed thing, than a helicopter, to me. Why would you have all that fancy helmet and what looked like an oxygen mask in a helicopter? they don't go high enough to need it do they?
Bernards alive
http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/7021/blessed2lc7.jpg
Season is improving, but I still wish they'd knock the love quadrangle on the head.
...and what was with the strange noises made as the helicopter fell out of the sky?
I too had a chuckle at the Scottishness of the flashbacks. The street did indeed look genuine but the beautiful, sunny countryside at the end looked way too good to be Scotland. The song was a hoot. :lol:
sleepy67
19-04-2007, 20:32
Thw woman's clothing suggested she'd jumped out of some sort of fighter jet or high altitude/speed thing, than a helicopter, to me. Why would you have all that fancy helmet and what looked like an oxygen mask in a helicopter? they don't go high enough to need it do they?Generally no, most helo's cant fly high enough that the pilot needs oxygen. BTW the reason she probably crashed is cos she had the sun visor down even though it was a couple of hours before dawn :cuckoo:
...and what was with the strange noises made as the helicopter fell out of the sky?At first I thought it was Smokey, but then I realised it didn't really sound like our old friend.
Season is improving, but I still wish they'd knock the love quadrangle on the head.Can you really call it a love quadrangle if only one person is conflicted?
Does anyone want a screencap or two of a certain scene?
Tom Whitaker
19-04-2007, 20:45
I love Lost. I really love it. But the last episode that left me all "meh" was the last Desmond flashback, which most people loved, and I thought this was a bit crap too. What I absolutely can not stand is the premonition plot device when the characters then proceed to make the flash-forward happen. If he saw that future event, like he saw the lightning and Clare drowning, then that was something that was already going to happen without his intervention, no? So the whole thing of having him put the group together and dictate what they were going to do is, for me, hugely frustrating to watch. How can you have a premonition of a fat man finding a cable when said fat man would not have ventured near said cable without the premonition? Sure, it can be explained (the premonition made him gather the group and, once gathered, the events would have played out in that order, aka fate) but it doesn't work for me as a viewer. It gets right on my tits, in fact.
I also thought the introduction of an outside visitor was pretty underwhelming. The four of them on the beach were surprised, but not that surprised. Ho hum.
Still, looking forward to the next episode, as always, and what I'm sure will be a killer finale. Any word on if the final two Jack episodes will be broadcast back to back?
PS - Bernard! w00t!
Spooksta
19-04-2007, 20:54
Did you spot the photo on the monk's desk when Desmond handed over his uniform?
Yes its was defo her from the ring shop. The one who would not let him have that ring and told him to dump Pen. (I think)
cockbongo
19-04-2007, 21:05
Does anyone want a screencap or two of a certain scene?
That would be awful.
Make it a large one, please.
I didn't spot that photo any caps?
Anyone mind posting next weeks trailer?
sleepy67
19-04-2007, 21:28
I didn't spot that photo any caps?http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/254/3x17mshawkingpicturebn3.th.jpg (http://img87.imageshack.us/my.php?image=3x17mshawkingpicturebn3.jpg)
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/254/3x17mshawkingpicturebn3.th.jpg (http://img87.imageshack.us/my.php?image=3x17mshawkingpicturebn3.jpg)
Not the screencap I was hoping for. :D
sleepy67
19-04-2007, 21:52
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sleepy67
19-04-2007, 21:54
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Disappearer
19-04-2007, 22:11
Nice to see Brian K Vaughan's name in the credits. One of the best comic book writer's around breaks into TV and helps script one of the best episodes of Lost this season.
SIMON ADEBISI
19-04-2007, 22:26
http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/7338/vlcsnap259923cm8.th.png (http://img167.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vlcsnap259923cm8.png)http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/4467/vlcsnap259963qn0.th.png (http://img167.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vlcsnap259963qn0.png)http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/8593/vlcsnap260082at7.th.png (http://img167.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vlcsnap260082at7.png)http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/2151/vlcsnap260103wb1.th.png (http://img167.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vlcsnap260103wb1.png)http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/9048/vlcsnap260148do4.th.png (http://img167.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vlcsnap260148do4.png)
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Grrr. My crap computer is as usua; only showing dark squares. Im assuming Kate is looking sweet in them though.
There was some cracking bluescreen work again in the episode as well.
Stevie G
19-04-2007, 22:43
PS Kate getting dressed :n0rty:
I don't remember much of the episode after that! Man, she's so gorgeous! A threesome with her and Scarlet Johannsen! :notworthy
Anyway......!
I clocked the odd picture on the monk's desk. Looked really fake, but I couldn't identify the old bid next to him. Must have been her from the earlier Desmond one tho.
Penny....thought I recognised her. Thought she was in Easteneders, but it was Sleeper Cell (just slightly different!) that she was in!
Does anyone know what guitar Charlie had? Looks reet nice! Maybe an Ovation or something! Wouldn't mind gitten me one of those! :D
Lol at Harsin's Bernard pic! :notworthy:
wong fei hong
19-04-2007, 22:44
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/254/3x17mshawkingpicturebn3.th.jpg (http://img87.imageshack.us/my.php?image=3x17mshawkingpicturebn3.jpg)
Looks like it was slapped together by a drunk with MS Paint...
Good ep, though - the Kate/Jack/Sawyer stuff particularly. And it's nice to see someone new, and that our heroes have a hope, however slim, of rescue,
Brian K Vaughan has been story editor all season, I think - at least since the Christmas break... I could really feel his input on the Sawyer dialogue this week.
sleepy67
19-04-2007, 22:51
Grrr. My crap computer is as usua; only showing dark squares. Im assuming Kate is looking sweet in them though.Yep. The images are png's which might be why you can't view them.
Here's a hint of what you're missing (jpg thumbnail and image):
http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/9121/dvdlostcapjh5.th.jpg (http://img201.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dvdlostcapjh5.jpg)
Didn't anyone else find it rather amusing that the Scottish monastery was producing expensive quality wine:lol: Since when did Scotland produce wine?
Now if it was Scotch....:thumbs:
KennyVader
20-04-2007, 06:19
Season is improving, but I still wish they'd knock the love quadrangle on the head.
They need that to keep the women watching, the "others/Dharma" storyline is too complicated for them ;)
Enjoyed this one, especially the premonitions stuff.
Thought Desmond's flashbacks were quite good too, quite important and a sensible gap filled (unlike some of the other ones, like Kate's.) Why he called everyone 'Brother' was nicely sorted out, made me smile anyway.
Found the Scottish street and house that Des' ex lived in fun, she had a massive house for that road... :)
That love Jack/Juliette/Kate/Sawyer quadrangle is getting a wee bit tedious. Hope it is going somewhere...
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/7392/kateassdb2.gif
...If he saw that future event, like he saw the lightning and Clare drowning, then that was something that was already going to happen without his intervention, no? So the whole thing of having him put the group together and dictate what they were going to do is, for me, hugely frustrating to watch. How can you have a premonition of a fat man finding a cable when said fat man would not have ventured near said cable without the premonition? ...I do agree that it seems really odd to actively pursue the premonition but perhaps he can not change events as he couldn't when he jumped into the past in the previous Desmond episode as indicated by the old lady?
Didn't anyone else find it rather amusing that the Scottish monastery was producing expensive quality wine:lol: Since when did Scotland produce wine?
Now if it was Scotch....:thumbs::lol: Of course you're right...hmm...what was that drink that Penny's dad drinks? The one that he didn't offer to Desmond in the interview in his previous episode?
cheeseypuffs
20-04-2007, 08:16
I love Lost. I really love it. But the last episode that left me all "meh" was the last Desmond flashback, which most people loved, and I thought this was a bit crap too. What I absolutely can not stand is the premonition plot device when the characters then proceed to make the flash-forward happen. If he saw that future event, like he saw the lightning and Clare drowning, then that was something that was already going to happen without his intervention, no? So the whole thing of having him put the group together and dictate what they were going to do is, for me, hugely frustrating to watch. How can you have a premonition of a fat man finding a cable when said fat man would not have ventured near said cable without the premonition? Sure, it can be explained (the premonition made him gather the group and, once gathered, the events would have played out in that order, aka fate) but it doesn't work for me as a viewer. It gets right on my tits, in fact.I was going to say the same :thumbs: Is it a paradox if no actual timetravel is involved :thinking: ie. he had a premonition, but it was a premonition which relied on him acting on said premonition :?: So presumably his premonitions take into account him acting on them, but then surely they'd all include him saving Charlie, and not seeing him die :?::?:
Also, on a side note, judging by the pilots attire, I'd say she was flying Airwolf ;)
I think the intervention of Desmond will only work if it is at the last possible moment. Too early and it might change altogether and might be even more fatal/dangerous/whatever. At least at the last second Desmond knows what is going to happen and act quickly (as seen with the arrow in the neck, nice moment by the way.)
Disappearer
20-04-2007, 08:40
Brian K Vaughan has been story editor all season, I think - at least since the Christmas break... I could really feel his input on the Sawyer dialogue this week.
Definitely. And I bet the Superman/Flash argument came from him too!
KennyVader
20-04-2007, 08:46
I love Lost. I really love it. But the last episode that left me all "meh" was the last Desmond flashback, which most people loved, and I thought this was a bit crap too. What I absolutely can not stand is the premonition plot device when the characters then proceed to make the flash-forward happen. If he saw that future event, like he saw the lightning and Clare drowning, then that was something that was already going to happen without his intervention, no? So the whole thing of having him put the group together and dictate what they were going to do is, for me, hugely frustrating to watch. How can you have a premonition of a fat man finding a cable when said fat man would not have ventured near said cable without the premonition? Sure, it can be explained (the premonition made him gather the group and, once gathered, the events would have played out in that order, aka fate) but it doesn't work for me as a viewer. It gets right on my tits, in fact.
I'm not really seeing it as a premonition of what's going to happen, more that the island is saying to Desmond "make this happen". It shows him that if a fat man pulls a cable up then they will see a flashing red light. If they hike in to the jungle they will find a person. If he let's Charlie die this time, the person will be Penny.
Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on whether you are Charlie or not) Desmond bottled at the last minute and saved Charlie again. So the person that fell from the sky was not Penny any more.
:shrug: just a theory.
I also thought the introduction of an outside visitor was pretty underwhelming. The four of them on the beach were surprised, but not that surprised. Ho hum.
Copy that. Distinctly underwhelmed at what you'd think they'd see as a rescue attempt. They did not even ask Desmond "so WTF has your girlfriend got to do with this place" etc.
PS - Bernard! w00t!
I reckon they just slipped that in to send a message to the fan sites who are all going "where's Rose and Bernard?" to tell them they read them ... :)
MetalGearAl
20-04-2007, 08:52
I noticed the photo on the desk but didn't pause it to get a good look of it - what that means however I don't know.
Another pointless flashback
What I absolutely can not stand is the premonition plot device when the characters then proceed to make the flash-forward happen.
Like the Kate episode 2 weeks ago this was all about the dichotomy of free will verses fate. Personally I think the Desmond premonitions are one of the strongest elements introduced this season and I love the paradox of having to follow 'historical' events in order for them to take place!
I love Lost. I really love it. But the last episode that left me all "meh" was the last Desmond flashback, which most people loved, and I thought this was a bit crap too. What I absolutely can not stand is the premonition plot device when the characters then proceed to make the flash-forward happen. If he saw that future event, like he saw the lightning and Clare drowning, then that was something that was already going to happen without his intervention, no? So the whole thing of having him put the group together and dictate what they were going to do is, for me, hugely frustrating to watch. How can you have a premonition of a fat man finding a cable when said fat man would not have ventured near said cable without the premonition? Sure, it can be explained (the premonition made him gather the group and, once gathered, the events would have played out in that order, aka fate) but it doesn't work for me as a viewer. It gets right on my tits, in fact.
If he didn't see it happen, he wouldn't have gathered them together; if he didn't gather them together, it wouldn't have happened. Surely the most obvious rebuttal to your objection is that this is commonly described as a catch-22 situation? Actually, when there's a catch-22 one is normally on the wrong side of it: can't get it started because of the catch. Desmond just seems to exist on the other side. I think the title, and the presence of the book, suggest that the writers are aware of the problem.
There are literary references all over Lost, and there are lots of books I'd now like to read because of that, but I must say that Catch-22 is probably my favourite novel and I whole-heartedly recommend it to everyone.
I'm not really seeing it as a premonition of what's going to happen, more that the island is saying to Desmond "make this happen". It shows him that if a fat man pulls a cable up then they will see a flashing red light. If they hike in to the jungle they will find a person. If he let's Charlie die this time, the person will be Penny.
I know we're talking about Lost here, but thats pretty far fetched. Theres no possible explanation (other than typical Lost unanswered magic) for the identity of the pilot to change after they had arrived from wherever they came from, whilst hangong from the trees.
If Charlie was supposed to die before the new person was sighted, then perhaps, there could have been a different person floating from the sky and they could have been Penny. But for the person to change whilst already on the island, well, thats going to require a considerable amount of time and space, bending and splicing, and perhaps some very confused faces on the people that experience it.
cockbongo
20-04-2007, 10:23
Surely the Catch-22 element refers to Charlie dying vs "Penny" "dying"?
Desmond believed that it was Penny dropping out of the sky, and this belief made him try and re-enact his flash-forward as accurately as possible - even if it included Charlie dying. His flashback constantly referred to the act of sacrifice and everything.
So to rescue "Penny" he felt he had to let Charlie die, but to save Charlie may well have meant he wouldn't have got to "Penny". Catch 22. The kicker in all this is that his flash forward didn't see far enough to let him know that it was Naomi who feel from the sky and not Penny.
Ditto on the "favourite novel" though - anyone who hasn't read Joseph Heller's book needs to remedy that immediately.
So to rescue "Penny" he felt he had to let Charlie die, but to save Charlie may well have meant he wouldn't have got to "Penny". Catch 22. The kicker in all this is that his flash forward didn't see far enough to let him know that it was Naomi who feel from the sky and not Penny....
Who is Naomi?? has she been seen before??
Frazer
...
Who is Naomi?? has she been seen before??
Frazer
Naomi: http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Naomi
Quincunx
20-04-2007, 12:05
Naomi: http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Naomi
Naomi, just before bailing out:
http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/2156/naomiin2.jpg
Naomi, just before bailing out:
http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/2156/naomiin2.jpg..
Thanks not her is it?, I don't recall seeing that scene during the episode, did I miss something??
Thanks jackal for the link.
Frazer
I think Quincunx missed a smiley.
I think Quincunx missed a smiley....
I think so too.:)
Quincunx's pic was of the fit helicopter pilot that Bond blows up in The Spy Who Loved Me.
Quincunx
20-04-2007, 13:16
Quincunx's pic was of the fit helicopter pilot that Bond blows up in The Spy Who Loved Me.
:thumbs:
"Naomi" was the name of the personal helicopter pilot/assistant (played by Caroline Munro) to "Karl Stromberg" in the James Bond film "The Spy Who Loved Me". In the film, Stromberg is a reclusive super-villain who lives in a submersible lair named "Atlantis". Naomi is the first female character ever to be killed by Bond when he shoots her out of the sky with a surface to air missile shot from his car/submarine.
wonderfibre
20-04-2007, 14:42
So the island changed things when Desmond disrupted things by saving Charlie? If he had let Charlie die as the island told him too in the flashes, it might have been Penny in the jump suit?
I'll need to watch it again to confirm but i'm pretty sure the flashes only showed the picture of Desmond & Penny rather than Penny herself. Desmond just made the assumption that it would be Penny
I dont get the helicopter. As has been mentioned they dont have a very long range and I cant believe that they are so near another settled island. The pacific is absolutely vast and a small island could be thousans of miles from anything else.
I cant wait to see how/if they explain this. I bet it will be that it wasnt actually a helicopter as we never see it.
The helicopter could have taken off from a ship....
Does anyone know what guitar Charlie had? Looks reet nice! Maybe an Ovation or something! Wouldn't mind gitten me one of those! :D
I just know them as electro-acoustics (because of the the rounded back)!
Looks like it was slapped together by a drunk with MS Paint...
my thoughts exactly but I also thought the same thing about Penny & Desmond's photo which we later found out was 'fake' to a certain extent. Not sure where the writers are going with it though....
So how does stopping Charlie dying make the pilot Penny? The pilot had already fallen from the sky and was hanging around in some trees, long before the potential death of Charlie. Maybe the pilot died because there's some kind of field around the entire island area? Much like the others' force-field for their base. The aircraft passed the field as it was approaching the island, and bang, down goes the aircraft, pilot has to eject.
Let's just hope they start answering this kind of stuff by seasons end. Not sure I'm that keen on watching another season thinking "I can speculate, but really, I've not got any idea what any of this is about".
Remember Desmond turning the key? No explanation at all, and that was nearly a season ago. When he turned the key and the screen went white you thought, my god, this could be the defining moment of Lost... problem is, we don't even know what it was.
Enjoyed the episode though, as I have with Desmond's previous ones.
Highlander
20-04-2007, 16:49
Maybe the pilot died ...
Is that confirmed?
Is that confirmed?
Nahhh. Just about nothing is confirmed on this show :nuts:
Just a theory.
Captain_Howdy666
20-04-2007, 18:19
I'll need to watch it again to confirm but i'm pretty sure the flashes only showed the picture of Desmond & Penny rather than Penny herself. Desmond just made the assumption that it would be Penny
The flashes only showed the picture, but to be fair to Desmond, he would be correct in his assumption. Kind of.
In his last flashback you see him and Penny together having that picture taken, after which he took the picture and then later it was with him on the island. As there was only one picture taken, how have both Des and Penny got copies? I don't recall Desmond and Penny seeing each other again after that moment (at least not to say "Hey, that picture we had taken, can I borrow it to get a copy?".
MrHat001
20-04-2007, 19:54
Well I think Hurley was right.
The Flash would kick Superman's arse. :)
Quincunx
20-04-2007, 20:19
This is taken from the premonition...
http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/1848/pennyvh0.jpg
Is this newly shot or just a bit from an old episode chosen to look like it takes place in a jungle?
Edit: He does seem to have long hair.
Alan_Mac
20-04-2007, 23:14
Watched this tonight. Good Episode!
I have a theory.
What if Desmond saving Charlie means he is, inadvertently, saving someone else too?
Saving Charlie from drowning-Claire is saved too.
Saving Charlie from Lightning-Aaron and Claire are saved too.
Saving Charlie from arrow- the Pilot is saved(Charlie getting killed by arrow would have meant time lost looking for the pilot and she may have died by the time they found her?)
What does it mean?
Damned if I know!!!:)
I think the whole thing about it not being Penny was just Desmonds paranoia. It was always going to be Naomi, even if Charlie died. As someone pointed out though, in the flashback he helps bring her down which happened after the arrow trap. I didn't know what to think, I assume it's an error otherwise Charlie is going to die on the way back!
Lol @ Losteria Lane, I don't think any of those excuses are plausable. Maybe the whole thing is a house price scam and they don't want to be guzumped.
AndyWilson
21-04-2007, 07:25
How do we know the island is in the middle of the pacific?
It seems odd that Juliet was drugged for the submarine journey - it's not as if she could have seen anything out of the windows!
Maybe the island is a lot closer to civilisation, and hence helicopters, than we think?
What if there were two people on the helicopter, the other being Penny. And by saving Charlie, their route on finding the survivor was to Naomi and not Penny.
wonderfibre
21-04-2007, 10:46
How do we know the island is in the middle of the pacific?
It seems odd that Juliet was drugged for the submarine journey - it's not as if she could have seen anything out of the windows!
Maybe the island is a lot closer to civilisation, and hence helicopters, than we think?
you're assuming that the journey was just by submarine. We also don't know for sure that the submarine isn't just there to make people think they arrived by submarine!
the writer's have made me too suspicious of everything now!
cheeseypuffs
21-04-2007, 11:02
How do we know the island is in the middle of the pacific?They were flying from Australia to the USA and detoured towards Fiji. Kind of points towards them being in the Pacific :shrug:
What if there were two people on the helicopter, the other being Penny. And by saving Charlie, their route on finding the survivor was to Naomi and not Penny.Well Naomi's alive, so if Penny baled out too she would probably say that Penny got out too then they can go look for her. Just because she might be hanging in a tree doesn't mean she's in imminent danger of death.
This is how they really get to the island...
http://publish.hometown.aol.com/goldfishrich/images/neverendingpeter.jpg
Reach the stars, fly a fantasy...
Dream a dream, and what you see will be...
Rhymes that keep their secrets
Will unfold behind the clouds
There upon the rainbow
Is the answer to a Neverending Story
Oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh
wong fei hong
21-04-2007, 11:15
We're back to philosophy, aren't we? Schrodinger's Cat, if a tree falls in the forest etc... There was no way to know who came out of the helicopter until their face was seen - according to Desmond's vision it may have been Penny. Therefore for Des it was equally Penny and someone else until the helmet came off.
Great stuff!
Sammy709Sony930
21-04-2007, 15:44
How do we know the island is in the middle of the pacific?
It seems odd that Juliet was drugged for the submarine journey - it's not as if she could have seen anything out of the windows!
Maybe the island is a lot closer to civilisation, and hence helicopters, than we think?
You assume that Juliet's journey was actually aboard the sub, however all we know is that she came too on a sub. Could have been placed in the sub after being brought by a different means.
AndyWilson
21-04-2007, 16:55
They were flying from Australia to the USA and detoured towards Fiji. Kind of points towards them being in the Pacific :shrug:
but not necessarily on some remote island - civilisation could be just over the horizon...
KennyVader
21-04-2007, 17:24
Either the owner of the house they used for filming in Scotland is an idiot or if it's a fake house then the set dresser is an idiot, because the door knocker that Desmond used is upside down.
http://img376.imageshack.us/img376/8346/vlcsnap4502485dz6.th.png (http://img376.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vlcsnap4502485dz6.png)
Unless that means something :nuts:
Professor Abronsius
21-04-2007, 20:27
Only one word springs to mind after watching this Epsiode...
Exempt... :thumbs:
the door knocker that Desmond used is upside down.
How is that upside down? :thinking:
KennyVader
21-04-2007, 22:57
How is that upside down? :thinking:
It just is. Looks stupid and unnatural.
Screwfix (http://www.thedvdforums.com/jump2.php?url=http://www.awin1.com/awclick.php?mid=1228&id=30372&p=http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/pro.jsp?cId=A332960&ts=96193&id=21876)
diytools.co.uk (http://www.thedvdforums.com/jump2.php?url=http://clkuk.tradedoubler.com/click?p(12572)a(60823)g(73911)url(http://www.diytools.co.uk/diy/Main/Category.asp?iCategoryID=1125))
Quincunx
22-04-2007, 00:01
It just is. Looks stupid and unnatural.
Screwfix (http://www.thedvdforums.com/jump2.php?url=http://www.awin1.com/awclick.php?mid=1228&id=30372&p=http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/pro.jsp?cId=A332960&ts=96193&id=21876)
diytools.co.uk (http://www.thedvdforums.com/jump2.php?url=http://clkuk.tradedoubler.com/click?p(12572)a(60823)g(73911)url(http://www.diytools.co.uk/diy/Main/Category.asp?iCategoryID=1125))
Does anyone else feel like they've passed into a whole new level now that we've had a link to a DIY shop on a Lost thread?
It just is. Looks stupid and unnatural.
Looks normal to me
Does anyone else feel like they've passed into a whole new level now that we've had a link to a DIY shop on a Lost thread?
Have we jumped the shark?
36Degrees
22-04-2007, 15:00
Thought Desmond's flashbacks were quite good too, quite important and a sensible gap filled (unlike some of the other ones, like Kate's.) Why he called everyone 'Brother' was nicely sorted out, made me smile anyway. Does this mean we're going to see why Hurley calls everyone dude?
Does this mean we're going to see why Hurley calls everyone dude?
Quite possibly...:thumbs:
LeftHandedGuitarist
22-04-2007, 22:20
Thought this was a weak and uninteresting episode personally, and a shame since we've had a run of top-notch stuff recently. I think I was secretly hoping Charlie would die.
68monkey
23-04-2007, 00:36
I think I was secretly hoping Charlie would die.
ditto
douglasb
23-04-2007, 09:14
Both the monk and the jilted ex were supposed to be Irish in my estimation.
However, the monastery appeared to be within driving distance of Carlisle. [Up the Blues!]
D.
Mr Flibble
23-04-2007, 09:49
Aye - Desmonds ex was supposed to be Irish I'm sure, but my god her accent was all over the shop! How hard would it be to get either someone
a)Irish
or
b)Scottish
to play the part?
GAmbrose
23-04-2007, 09:54
She was Scottish, she sounded Irish at first but then it settled down into Scots and it couldn't have been far from the Monastery.
The Monk sounded completely Scottish to me.
Gary A
cpheonix
23-04-2007, 09:58
No, she was definitely meant to be Irish. Yes it was a ropey accent, same as the monk, but it was definitely Irish. Never thought about driving up the road to Carlisle but, yeah, that doesnt make sense now.
2 things that bug me now about Lost:
1) Sawyer is now just a figure of fun
and
2) Hurley just seems to be getting bigger and bigger. That dude needs to have a clause in his contract to lose weight - it would make the show and himself a lot better.
Hmmm, interesting episode in a way. Mainly for the new (and possibly shortlived) character. Seems she knew Desmond. Which could suggest she may have been looking for him. Which could suggest she may have found the island on purpose. Which could suggest te island can be seen from the outside under the right conditions. Or not, it could all be coincidence. This is lost!
"Perhaps you underestime the value of sacrifice" said flashback Monk. Did Desmond sacrifice his dream of finding Penny in order to save Charlie? Is there a value in saving Charlie. Is the island telling Desmond not that Charlie will die, but that Charlie must live (be saved).
Too man possibilities, I thinkI have a nose bleed now.
Mr Flibble
23-04-2007, 11:55
Hmmm, interesting episode in a way. Mainly for the new (and possibly shortlived) character. Seems she knew Desmond. Which could suggest she may have been looking for him.
I assumed she knew him, because she had a picture, and Penny had given her the photo, so she could identify him?
wong fei hong
23-04-2007, 12:13
2 things that bug me now about Lost:
1) Sawyer is now just a figure of fun
I think that Sawyer has always been a figure of fun to some extent, and indeed very few characters get away without being lampooned or satirised. Sawyer is ridiculous - guarded, foolishly macho, greedy, lustful. He can be a badass, and will again no doubt, but Sawyer's mellowing to the other survivors and increased willingness to co-operate is entirely understandable given the circumstances. It's really only a fortnight since he took an almighty beating, faced what seemed like a certain execution, did a sex with Kate and then clobbered Danny in a harsh manner.
Last week's Sawyer and Sayid's menacing face-off with Juliet was hardly the stuff of light relief...
I only say "seems" because this is Lost and anything is possible!
basegreen
23-04-2007, 12:22
I assumed she knew him, because she had a picture, and Penny had given her the photo, so she could identify him?
There's no doubt she's part of Penny Widmore's attempt to locate Desmond.
The Portuguese book (catch 22) tied in with the language spoken by Penny's people out in the listening station (Season 2 climax)... the picture of desmond in there as well....
anephric
23-04-2007, 12:38
We're back to philosophy, aren't we? Schrodinger's Cat, if a tree falls in the forest etc...
I made a solemn oath to punch anyone who used Schrodinger's Cat in conversation ever, so consider yourself chinned.
Most. Overused. Infuriating. Paradigm. Ever.
wong fei hong
23-04-2007, 12:47
I made a solemn oath to punch anyone who used Schrodinger's Cat in conversation ever, so consider yourself chinned.
Most. Overused. Infuriating. Paradigm. Ever.
Sorry, I fully sympathize. Truly.
But... pat philosophy is part of Lost, and that's one of the ideas that the show was trying to invoke this week. So I accept the chinning but I was right so I'm going to stab you while you're asleep.
anephric
23-04-2007, 14:38
Can't you just take my brain out instead? I might enjoy S3 then.
Arf.
cpheonix
23-04-2007, 14:57
Can anyone explain what the heck is Schrodinger's Cat? I tried looking on Wiki and got even more confused, so a non-technical explanation would be great.
wong fei hong
23-04-2007, 15:08
Since I brought it up, I'll rub my sore chin and attempt to explain...
Imagine a cat in a box, a special box where it is exempt from all outside factors. For us outside the box, it is impossible to observe whether the cat is alive or dead, and so the cat attains a "superposition" - it exists for us in both alive and dead states simultaneously.
It's the paradox of not knowing the outcome of an experiment without interfering with it and therefore directly affecting the outcome.
ascender
23-04-2007, 15:13
This isn't the first time there's been inconsistencies and for wont of a better word, "shoddiness" in flashbacks. What's with the terribly amateur photo on the monk's desk and the accents and the like? Nothing comes close to the Dick van Dyke, Mary Poppins-esque London during Desmond's other flashback this season, but come on, in a show which seems to be all about the details, why are they so lax with certain stuff????
'Cause only America matters. Or something.
cockbongo
23-04-2007, 15:27
This isn't the first time there's been inconsistencies and for wont of a better word, "shoddiness" in flashbacks. What's with the terribly amateur photo on the monk's desk and the accents and the like? Nothing comes close to the Dick van Dyke, Mary Poppins-esque London during Desmond's other flashback this season, but come on, in a show which seems to be all about the details, why are they so lax with certain stuff????
I actually thought they did ok - it could have been soooo much worse. Ruth could have been called Heather, her brother could have been wearing a kilt, etc. As i said before, not many major US TV shows can incorporate "For It's a Grand Old Team To Play For..." into an episode. Sure the accents were dodgy but to me that's just par for the course - do you remember how bad the Aussie accents were in "Numbers"??
Mind you, people still moan about Claire's "dodgy" Aussie accent in 'Lost'! :nuts:
anephric
23-04-2007, 15:51
Since I brought it up, I'll rub my sore chin and attempt to explain...
Imagine a cat in a box, a special box where it is exempt from all outside factors. For us outside the box, it is impossible to observe whether the cat is alive or dead, and so the cat attains a "superposition" - it exists for us in both alive and dead states simultaneously.
Your Threat Level has been raised from mere physical assault to sub-atomic liquidation.
wong fei hong
23-04-2007, 15:52
Bwa-ha-ha!
Quincunx
23-04-2007, 17:31
Can anyone explain what the heck is Schrodinger's Cat? I tried looking on Wiki and got even more confused, so a non-technical explanation would be great.
It's all explained in John Carpenter's Prince of Darkness. Plus you get Donald Pleasance and backwards worms.
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/254/3x17mshawkingpicturebn3.th.jpg (http://img87.imageshack.us/my.php?image=3x17mshawkingpicturebn3.jpg)
Ahh Pat Butcher's high profile transfer to Lost must have been finalised!!! :thumbs:
Mark
I think I was secretly hoping Charlie would die.
They're definitely toying with us over this one...
"I've been checking out some internet forums, and it seems like everyone wants Charlie to die in the most horrible way possible"
"Excellent. In that case we'll torture the audience by showing visions of various hideous Charlie-deaths followed by his stupid, grinning, still-alive face"
"Good work!"
(pops Champagne cork)
Island Swing
27-04-2007, 15:02
Finally got round to watching this.
Didnt the monk have a Northern Irish accent?
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