View Full Version : TalkTalk's unfair fair usage policy - users beware.
Ok, signed up with Talk Talk (http://www.thedvdforums.com/jump2.php?url=http://tracker.tradedoubler.com/click?p=19115&a=60823&g=578368) for telephone and internet about four months ago. They seemed to be the cheapest option.
Cannot fault their Telephone service, but rather narked off with their internet service.
I have recently had a cap put on my line due to "excessive usage". This is on an unmetered, unlimited access line.
They didn't warn me they were going to do it, they didn't even tell me they'd done it. I downloaded ONE large file off usenet and that was it.
When I tried to find out what amount of download qualified people for a cap, they told me the amount downloaded was irrelevent. They simply cap the top 20% of users each month regardless of actual usage.
They couldn't tell me what the amount I actually downloaded was, and refused to put me through to a manager.
Totally unimpressed, especially as I spent 25 mins on a premium rate to their tech support people to find out why I was having such problems, and it was only at the end of that call that they said "Well, we've tried everything else, it must be your cap" :mad:
wasn't sure whether it was general or suppliers.
It was obviously neither! :lol:
bambi2002
24-01-2006, 13:14
Email them and ask them to show you exactly which term or condition you've broken in their T&C's - when/if they can't tell you, then demand the money back from your phone call, and a lifting of the cap - or a relaease from the contract (free of charge to you) for them breaking the contract and migrate to a different provider.
IMO TalkTalk/CPW are useless at customer service and you'd be better off somewhere else
Again, its like Tiscali's "Unlimited Service" TV advert. Fair usage Policy applies.
Arggghhhh.... who deems the fup? Of course its the ISP!
ISP's these days are really taking the biscuit!
Why don't people understand that they're not going to be able to have an all-you-can-eat, unrestricted broadband product (essentially a commercial grade connection) at a consumer price? Talk about burying your head in the sand!
Why don't people understand that they're not going to be able to have an all-you-can-eat, unrestricted broadband product (essentially a commercial grade connection) at a consumer price? Talk about burying your head in the sand!
Exactly. If you really wanted a truely unmetered service, you'd be looking at paying in excess of £200/month (I can't remember the exact figure.)
So usage policies are the done thing, as annoying as that may be, it is here to stay.
Also, as I (and possibly others) may have pointed out. These services are still 'unlimited' (excluding specifically capped ones) as they don't stop you from downloading as much as you like, they just slow you down.
Why don't people understand that they're not going to be able to have an all-you-can-eat, unrestricted broadband product (essentially a commercial grade connection) at a consumer price? Talk about burying your head in the sand!
But in this case, th top 20% of users in that month are capped regardless of what they have used.
They might never have used p2p in their life (I haven't - just one newsgroup download) and I was capped. next month, the same amount of downloads would not result in a cap, depending on what others have downloaded.
I dont think thats fair personally.
I'm not a high user.
And they should at least be bothered to email you and tell you, not charge you 25 minutes on a premium rate line and then tell you at the end. So Teece and Ohood go ahead and defend this policy.
I will still regard it as unfair.
I will still regard it as unfair.
I do too, I realise my post doesn't seem like that but I am with Pipex and have begrudgingly accepted it (mostly due to a technophobic parent who doesn't like change. :) )
I think (or rather hope) it will be a relatively short-lived method of control. A bit of the blame for all of this seems fall at BT's feet, as they've been acting like the child who has all the toys and doesn't want anyone else to play with them. That seems to be changing a little with LLU, we can only hope this will also see a change in FUPs. I don't know for sure, but I am hopelessly idealistic when it comes to this sort of think.
But in this case, th top 20% of users in that month are capped regardless of what they have used.
They might never have used p2p in their life (I haven't - just one newsgroup download) and I was capped. next month, the same amount of downloads would not result in a cap, depending on what others have downloaded.
I dont think thats fair personally.
I'm not a high user.
And they should at least be bothered to email you and tell you, not charge you 25 minutes on a premium rate line and then tell you at the end. So Teece and Ohood go ahead and defend this policy.
I will still regard it as unfair.
I wasn't defending Talk Talk - it does sound shoddy. I was talking about ISPs in general, aimed at hailsey's comment.
Do ADSL ISP's have a different policy to cable providers (particularly Telewest).
I hammer mine 24X7 and havent heard a peep. I must download around 25 gb a week.
i downloaded over 140gb last month and havent had mine capped.
I am with f2s and other have experienced probs though
exactly...
Whenever this topic comes up you always get people saying this (or something very similar)
Why don't people understand that they're not going to be able to have an all-you-can-eat, unrestricted broadband product (essentially a commercial grade connection) at a consumer price?
That's exactly what I get from Telewest BY... I don't hammer it much now but for the first year or so I caned it 24/7 downloading gigs and gigs worth of stuff. For the first coupla months I downloaded.. 250gb a month .. 2mb connection.
Telewest never said a single word about it.. if they have a Fair Use Policy then it is obviously not adhered to...
So is this restriction only on ADSL then?
Cos if so it seems the answer is ... yes you can have an all-you-can-eat connection you've just gotta be in a Telewest area :)
(by the way this isn't meant to be a post saying how great telewest is.. just that all-you-can-eat IS possible but for some reason ADSL companies can't offer it.)
I think the biggest problem is that the ISP don't say what a fair usage per month is. I'm with Pipex and would love to now when I'm reching my 'limit' on fair usage per month.
However no-one from Pipex is able to tel me exactly what the limits are and this is what I find annoying.
I just wish we could see in black and white exactly what they deem as fair use and not just a phrse they use...
...which Plusnet DO do, and allow you to view your figures as and when (not quite 'live' - I think they say there's a 2-hour lag).
stillill
25-01-2006, 12:04
i downloaded over 140gb last month and havent had mine capped.
I am with f2s and other have experienced probs though
Hee he! Probably why people are leaving F2S - can't get any bandwidth 'cos you've got it all! :)
How about the BT cap then lol.....40 gig but if you do go over it we will let you know if you do so by to much etc etc
WEll hard to work out....
The 3 little pigs
25-01-2006, 15:20
i downloaded over 140gb last month and havent had mine capped.
I am with f2s and other have experienced probs though
Woa! :eek:
I thought I was being naughty when I downloaded 15Gb in a month! :D
DeadKenny
25-01-2006, 21:03
But in this case, th top 20% of users in that month are capped regardless of what they have used.
Surely by being in the top 20% they have used more than the other 80%? :thinking:
Do ADSL ISP's have a different policy to cable providers (particularly Telewest).
I hammer mine 24X7 and havent heard a peep. I must download around 25 gb a week.
Wait until NTL apply their rules when the takeover is complete ;)
The only real difference is that ADSL is generally piped through BT and there are limits based on what ADSL providers buy off BT so they all tend to set the same rules. LLU ADSL is a little different.
Why don't people understand that they're not going to be able to have an all-you-can-eat, unrestricted broadband product (essentially a commercial grade connection) at a consumer price? Talk about burying your head in the sand!
Exactly. As speeds increase and more pirate material becomes available, 24/7 full speed leeching is just unsustainable for the peanuts prices of consumer broadband. ADSL and even Cable was never designed for it, especially for P2P which depends on heavy saturation of upstream links (Cable suffers from this badly when congested). However at present many toys are being thrown out of prams as people get the reality of life thrown in their face ;)
How about the BT cap then lol.....40 gig but if you do go over it we will let you know if you do so by to much etc etc
WEll hard to work out....
Yes, BT do let you know if you go over the limit and they let you know by how much. At thew same time they also announce they will be charging you £1 for every GigaByte you have used over your allowance, and they will collect it automatically when your next monthly subscription payment is due.
sidebog7
25-01-2006, 21:34
What about when the BBC iMP is active? People could quite easily be up and downloading 24/7 without the dreaded 'piracy' label.
DeadKenny
25-01-2006, 21:41
iMP is unlikely to be downloading 24/7, at least not from what I experienced on the earlier trials. The size of downloads are fairly small compared to entire movies and it just downloads during idle time I think possibly giving priority to other apps, unlike P2P apps which download at full whack saturating everything.
Many ISPs are working with the BBC over the iMP trials anyway and will likely provide exceptions or QoS for iMP and similar services so effectively it won't count.
Besides there's nothing to say that ISP's can't increase the limits. They have done frequently in the past.
Yes, BT do let you know if you go over the limit and they let you know by how much. At thew same time they also announce they will be charging you £1 for every GigaByte you have used over your allowance, and they will collect it automatically when your next monthly subscription payment is due.
Not in any of the notifications ive had, as i go over 100 gig every month.
Let me see if i can dig them out, as ive never heard of them letting anyone know apart from the letter they send saying either leave or pay up?
EDIT
We’ve got some great news about TWO improvements we’re making to your broadband. And don’t worry, they are improvements at NO extra cost!
You’ll be aware that each of our products comes with a usage guideline. This is the amount of data you can send and receive through your broadband connection each month. However, as we don’t want anything to get in the way of your enjoyment of the Internet, we’re making two important improvements to the way usage guidelines work.
A new approach to usage guidelines – to give you more freedom
Although the vast majority of our customers are within the current usage guidelines for their product, some customers have told us that they feel restricted. So we’ve responded.
Our new approach to usage guidelines means you are free to use your broadband without the fear of being limited or charged.
From now on, if you occasionally exceed your monthly usage guideline there will be no need to worry, as you’ll be able to continue using the service as normal for the rest of the month without any restrictions or additional charges.
In fact, as long as you don’t regularly exceed your usage guideline by a large amount, you have no need to worry whatsoever. If you do regularly go over the allowance, we may contact you about moving to a more appropriate product for your needs. However given that the usage guideline for BT Yahoo! Broadband is more than enough for most people on this product, it’s unlikely this will be necessary.
And an increased monthly usage guideline at no extra cost
Additionally, as there are more and more things you can do with a broadband connection, we have decided to increase your usage guideline anyway. This means your monthly usage guideline will be increased from 30GB to 40GB, giving you even more reason to relax and enjoy your broadband.
And you don’t have to do a thing
In order to take advantage of these improvements to your service you don’t need to do a thing. More information and updated Terms and Conditions are available at www.bt.com/broadband/news These changes will come into effect on 15th October 2005.
Just thought we would tell you the good news. Thank you for being a valued customer of BT Yahoo! Broadband.
URN:...
From now on, if you occasionally exceed your monthly usage guideline there will be no need to worry, as you’ll be able to continue using the service as normal for the rest of the month without any restrictions or additional charges.
In fact, as long as you don’t regularly exceed your usage guideline by a large amount, you have no need to worry whatsoever. If you do regularly go over the allowance, we may contact you about moving to a more appropriate product for your needs. However given that the usage guideline for BT Yahoo! Broadband is more than enough for most people on this product, it’s unlikely this will be necessary.
See what i mean its not very clear, they dont define what any of the amounts are?
Then i got this one
Dear Mr Prosser,
Thanks to valuable feedback from customers like you, we’ve made some exciting changes to your broadband service. Firstly, we’ve given it a simpler name: BT Broadband Option 4. Plus, we’re giving you a better value package than ever before:
If you're thinking about going wireless, find out about our wireless router for only £10.
Find out more >
A quick reminder of your great BT Yahoo! online features1
Keeping you protected
Your broadband service now comes with BT Yahoo! Online Protection, an all-in-one security suite to help you enjoy the Internet with greater peace of mind. You get robust security features and benefits:
* Easy, all-in-one interface is user-friendly and requires minimal attention
* PC Anti-Virus is included at no additional charge and protects your computer from online threats
* BT Yahoo! Mail protection protects your inbox with tools like SpamGuard Plus, AddressGuard TM, email Anti-Virus and
Anti-Phishing.
* You also get Anti-Spy, Pop-Up Blocker, and powerful parental controls to keep your PC, your files, and your family safer online.
Find out more >
Don’t forget
Your usage guideline increased from 30GB to 40GB as part of our introduction of a Fair Usage Policy. That gives you more surfing and downloading every month.
One thing we haven’t changed is the price
Remember, all these additional services are ready for you to use when you want them, and are all included in your monthly fee of just £29.99 a month.2
Bt havnt even got a facility when you can check what your usage is anyway as they havnt got the software working.
Then there is this one....
http://www.adslguide.org.uk/images/news/btletter.jpg
See here as well
http://www.ispreview.co.uk/cgi-bin/news/viewnews.cgi?id=EEFuEkEFpZbtTyZyzt
As you can see theres no way BT can turn round and just charge you £1 a gig if you go over the cap if there is no way of knowing if you have gone over the cap. And ive never heard of them doing so. Im just waiting for the letter but havnt received one yet as i go over the cap everymonth easily as there are multiple users in the house. But i dont want to leave the service as its been excellent, and ive had it since being a trialist in 97
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