PDA

View Full Version : In defense of Pearl harbor...


sanejo
04-12-2001, 18:31
In defense of Pearl Harbor.
(Which is rather more than the U.S. managed.)

Was it last April we in the DVD community were getting all excitable about the biggest start-up budget film of all time?
Those tasty, teasing TV ads. Bombs eye views, screaming Mitsubishi zeros, Browning 50 cals spitting death, boy scouts ******* by their tent.
Then came the cinema release and horror of horrors, the film is a dud. Uninspired script, insipid acting, poorly researched and way long, way too long. Eager anticipation turned to bitter disappointment, and then, in turn to dismissal.
The reviews must have had Walt damning live action to the seventh level of hell, the Mouse house could hardly have imagined just how wrong a film could get.
The cinema release had been, in a trivial way, a parallel of that day "that will live in infamy". With the potential to have been the biggest and the best, poor preparation, failure to appreciate the signs and complacency had led to a film that failed to engage an audience as it should.
But, just as the Pacific fleets mauling, whilst a terrible blow, had ultimately been a failure, so a poor cinema release, has I think to a large extent been combated by a far more satisfactory DVD.
(The Japanese plan failed because the U.S. carrier fleet was not at Pearl on that fateful day, so instead of the 2 years free of U.S. intervention in the Pacific they had anticipated, the Japanese had exactly 9 months before the first U.S. counter offensive at Guadalcanal.)
I saw the movie for the first time on Sunday night, R2 rental for £2, those early TV ads, and National Geographic, had done their job. Lousy love interest and cheesy dialogue were not going to keep me away from that lovely CGI and 5.1, no sir.
You know what's coming, I enjoyed this movie, quite alot.
The first eighty minutes, which seem to be the main gripe most people have with this movie, are not good, but, they're not dreadful, not even bad.
This film certainly deserved, needed, a cracking opening, a hook to draw you in and engage your emotions, what you get, is a sort of coming of age, first love, lost love melodrama. I think this part of the movie is reasonably well balanced, it has a few scripted laughs, one or two unintentional laughs, the jolly banter of the RAF types spring to mind here, some romance, a little fore taste of the action to come, setting the time and place, and some character building, Top gun with propellers.
The leading trio are not method actors they are character actors, and I think they do as well as the script allows. Afleck I think is actually good, for me he pretty well carried this part of the film.
Of course Cuba Gooding jr. is introduced in this part as well, why we don't see more of him I can not fathom, that is one of the things this film is truly guilty of, wasting talent.
Long as this section is, I only felt that it was 10 or so minutes too much, my wife could have watched it, in all its soapy glory, for weeks.
When the attack begins this film really does become all it should have been, CGI, live action, total sound immersion, like SPR it is brutal, perhaps not quite as visceral, not quite as personal but more dynamic. The action is fast, slow, airborne, seaborne, in town and on airbases, it leaves you disorientated and drained...it works.
The fear and confusion, especially of the nurses, is well conveyed.
The heroics of the male leads is once again more Top gun than SPR,
but that fits with the tone.
The Doolittle raid is perhaps the least satisfactory section clearly a plot device to make 3 into 2 go.
I have one question, is that Jabba the Hutt playing Roosevelt?

Many have criticised this film for being inaccurate, it maybe that it is not an historical document, but its faults come from trying to simplify complex issues, not a desire to mislead or obfuscate.

As narrative this movie is more enjoyable than I was expecting, it is not a great movie and that is a great shame, it is however no worse than any number of action flicks we all sit through, indeed for much of its running time it is a stunning piece of work.
If you haven't seen this movie because of the bad reviews, at least hire it, you'll be pleasantly surprised. After all if you had spent $200,000,000 on this film being ******* at the result would be justified, for £3.00 it's a steal, even owning it for £16.99 is a bit of a bargain.

I ordered my R1 copy today, the attack scene will be my reference piece to display my setup to anyone foolish enough to say "What's this DVD stuff like then?"

utero
04-12-2001, 18:35
I'd like to sew up your comments on the film with the phrase "you can't polish a turd"

Anyone who's read the script will be amazed that they threw that much money at it.

Kit_Taylor
04-12-2001, 22:27
Why watch/buy an okay film when you can watch an excellent one instead.

Ono
04-12-2001, 23:05
I thought it was good.:clap:

arkham
04-12-2001, 23:06
the first hour was **** but the rest was really good

Jimmyboy
04-12-2001, 23:42
I really loved Pearl Harbour.
Its now my 3rd favourite film of all time behind "Dude, Wheres My Car", & "Wild Wild West".

The Dude
05-12-2001, 01:17
Originally posted by Jimmyboy
I really loved Pearl Harbour.
Its now my 3rd favourite film of all time behind "Dude, Wheres My Car", & "Wild Wild West".

Battlefield Earth is your fourth favourite film of all time, I take it? ;)

Davester
05-12-2001, 01:53
Originally posted by Jimmyboy
I really loved Pearl Harbour.
Its now my 3rd favourite film of all time behind "Dude, Wheres My Car", & "Wild Wild West". :clap:

martinb
05-12-2001, 06:16
michael bay must be so proud that his film has been relegated to showing off people's home cinema setups.

Roberto
05-12-2001, 07:28
I thought that all Michael Bay films where home cinema setup meterial? :D

Ol' Blue Eyes
05-12-2001, 07:31
My top three Pearl Harbour quotes -

"I'm giving my heart to Danny but I'll never look at another sunset without thinking of you".

"Returning from the dead wasn't all that I expected... but that's life."

"You're so pretty it hurts."
"It's your nose that hurts."
"I think it's my heart."

akira9000
05-12-2001, 07:34
Hollywood is Hollywood, people.
Pearl Harbour is not a great film.
Pearl Harbour is a great film to watch with a girl.





The End

toovster
05-12-2001, 15:17
Sad to say i actually enjoyed this one at the cinema *sigh*, let the flaming begin ;)

carryonline
05-12-2001, 15:23
I, for one, thought Sanejo's comments were extremely well reasoned and that his defence of Pearl Harbour is well argued.

Unfortunately, I still think the film's a sack of arse :D

Byron
05-12-2001, 16:26
It was 3 hours of instantly forgettable, superficial, tawdry, overblown, poorly acted, and massively pretentious unalloyed ********. This I won’t dispute for a second.

But the attack was enjoyable (though under-whelming in the extreme – it was just too frenetic, never pausing long enough to provide a moment of resonance), and the “love story” side-splittingly hilarious. I found it consistently entertaining, not despite, but because of its swathe of flaws. All I found genuinely offensive was the shamefully sanitised portrayal of Japan’s wartime brutality (presenting the Japanese who planned the attack as honourable Samurai) to appeal to the Japanese home market (it may have worked, I’d like to think it wouldn’t have; but the fact it was so crap no one bothered seeing it prevents us from ever finding out).

So bovine verbal excrement it is, but on the most superficial of levels, quite enjoyable, falling comfortably into the good old “so bad its good” category. :)

Could well buy the ultra-violence cut coming out next year.

Mike
05-12-2001, 18:59
Those deriding the love story might want to reflect that it's not much more idiotic than those featured in films of the period being recreated, and could thus be considered entirely appropriate in context - watch "Waterloo Bridge" if you don't believe me. Then read "A Farewell To Arms", the central love affair in which is just as trite as the one in "Pearl Harbour".

Richie
05-12-2001, 19:17
Just to add to what Mike says above...

I've said this countless times on the forums - the love story in Pearl Harbour is no more ridiculous, trite and just plain daft than that of my real life Grandparents! without whom I, of course, would not be here today.
I blubbed like a complete baby seeing this film at the cinema. The Rafe character was like my Grandfather - wanting to fly in combat and not just teach the flyers (which was exactly what my Grandfather also had to deal with!). And I saw it just a few weeks after my Grandmother died and the DAY before I'd read a very old letter from 1940 where she described to her sister back in Austrailia how she'd crossed a U-boat infested Atlantic the year before bound home back to Austrailia - only to get to New York and change her mind!! - so she goes back across a U-boat infested Atlantic to the arms of my Grandfather in Blighty!
If THAT was a film NO-ONE would give it a chance 'cause it's soooo daft!!!!
:D
Richie

Jez
06-12-2001, 02:17
Originally posted by Byron
(presenting the Japanese who planned the attack as honourable Samurai)

Could well buy the ultra-violence cut coming out next year.

Well thats how they might have been, you dont know that, so are they just ment to be shown as the horribal baddies, well then you would be saying what an un-original film it is.

Oh and it aint an ultra-violent cut, pop over the the home theater forums and find the producer of the dvd David Prior talkin about what is in and out basicley just a few shots here and there.

:argue:

Cheers

Paul490
06-12-2001, 05:57
Plainly what happened is that there was a huge hype bulidup before the film came out in the United States and the United Kingdom, and when we eventually saw it it turned out to be a pile of crap.

I did see it at the cinema, and I can honestly say that that was the worst three hours I have ever spent watching a film in my life. The love story was in the way, annoying and terribly done, but the action scenes were just about OK. Bang-bang action with bombs does not make a good romantic/action movie.

And now in an attempt to get people to buy this awful film, they are going to create a massive extras package for it. Massive extras would not compensate for this plainly terrible piece of junk from director Michael Bay.

I suspect that the extras, however big the package actually is, will simply be a load of press filler junk, bad US made-for-TV documentaries and trailers.

(breathes out) Rant over. :rolleyes:

martinb
06-12-2001, 08:25
to say that the crud dialogue is ok because films from the 40's had similar dialogue is a bit of a sad argument, if this was supposed to be a homage to films from the era then why have cgi effects and film it in colour with dolby sound?

Ol' Blue Eyes
06-12-2001, 10:02
Originally posted by Richie
Just to add to what Mike says above...

I've said this countless times on the forums - the love story in Pearl Harbour is no more ridiculous, trite and just plain daft than that of my real life Grandparents! without whom I, of course, would not be here today.
I blubbed like a complete baby seeing this film at the cinema. The Rafe character was like my Grandfather - wanting to fly in combat and not just teach the flyers (which was exactly what my Grandfather also had to deal with!). And I saw it just a few weeks after my Grandmother died and the DAY before I'd read a very old letter from 1940 where she described to her sister back in Austrailia how she'd crossed a U-boat infested Atlantic the year before bound home back to Austrailia - only to get to New York and change her mind!! - so she goes back across a U-boat infested Atlantic to the arms of my Grandfather in Blighty!
If THAT was a film NO-ONE would give it a chance 'cause it's soooo daft!!!!
:D
Richie


:confused: That's not ridiculous at all. Women are famous for changing their minds no matter what the consequences.

Ridiculous is -

"boy meets girl, boy and girl fall in love, boy flies off to Europe, girl just happens to be posted at same Hawaiian base as boy's best friend, boy is presumed killed in accident that (as filmed) could not be survived, best friend comforts girl, best friend shags girl, boy turns up alive weeks later without having bothered to send any word, boy finds out best friend has boned girl, boy and best friend have punch-up, girl chooses best friend with possibly the worst line of romantic dialogue ever written, boy and best friend make up after horror of Japanese attack teaches them what is important in life (!), girl gets bun in oven, girl tells boy but not best friend about bun in oven, boy and best friend go on dangerous raid, best friend dies in ludicrous shoot-out, boy promises to look after best friend's girl and baby before he snuffs it, boy gets girl after all, the end"

dogbert
06-12-2001, 15:06
Well thats how they might have been, you dont know that, so are they just ment to be shown as the horribal baddies, well then you would be saying what an un-original film it is.

its pretty much fact that the japanese were very brutal. i watched a documentary about how the japanese tortured raped and murdered, women and little children,wheres the honour in that ???

In fact where's the honour in any war.............there is none, its all just about killing to settle an arguement.

Byron
06-12-2001, 19:01
Originally posted by Jez


Well thats how they might have been, you dont know that, so are they just ment to be shown as the horribal baddies, well then you would be saying what an un-original film it is. …

Well actually, from the swathes of witness testimony (from both the Japanese people themselves and those from countries who were the nation’s wartime victims), documentary footage, diaries, and plenty more evidence from the period, its something of an overwhelmingly proven fact Japan’s wartime conduct, stemming from before the Second World War to Japan’s war with China in the 1930s, was often brutal in the extreme. I trust you didn’t watch the revealing Hell in the Pacific series on Channel 4 recently, nor anything similar. Quite clearly, you have little to no knowledge of the matter whatsoever to make such an absurd statement against all the contrary proof.

Your statement appears to be motivated by timidity about causing any offence to anyone whatever the context. I would never mention Japan’s wartime conduct unless it was clearly pertaining to the matter under discussion, as it is here – just as I’d mention some of, say, Britain’s various atrocities under the empire, or Nazi Germany, if it were relevant.

If the Japanese characters of the film had been portrayed as one-dimensional evil-incarnate caricatures, then you’re damn right, I would be equally scathing. But adopting the opposite extreme, utterly sanitising the entire affair and the country’s motives with a brazen disregard to historical fact in order to sell tickets in the Japanese home market, is equally repugnant.

agnetha
08-12-2001, 18:53
I quite liked it too, and I don't normally like your usual Yank 'let's re-write history, only one man/one nation can save the world' type crap. Nowhere near as good as SPR (and certainly no Tenko)but enjoyable enough, even the silly romantic sub-plot. My only real moan is that the subtitles when the Japs spoke were FAR too small.

Ono
08-12-2001, 21:34
I thought it was very good and I would re-watch the film again (one I can spare 3 hours to view it:D ) which is more than I could say for some of the other films in my collection.