Star Wars IV, V, VI. Are they spoiled?

[Morton]

Will the first three Star Wars eventually ruin the last three?

While working my way the excellent Episode One Dvd I got thinking; when all 6 films are lined up, for someone who hasn't seen them before, they will see the story developing from the very beginning so that the plot twists and surprises in the latter three will fail to be twists and surprises, the impact will totally be lost.

For example; I remember watching Empire Strikes Back for the first time, as a child, and the immoratal words- "Luke, I am your Father", were shocking. Future generations will be saying "D'uh, we know that!!". Or that Luke and Leia are related, no surprises.

On the other hand will it just not matter at all. I've watched the Trilogy countless times, I know what's going to happen and yet, for me the impact hasn't wained. However, this could just be me remembering the impact of the first viewing.

Ouch, too much double thinking!!!!!!:rolleyes:

[gZa]

Just watch them in the order they were released! :rolleyes:

[FaustBos]

Yeah, you can watch them in the order they are released as someone else said, thats probably the best thing to do. The story could hide the fact that luke is DV's son as well. Afterall, Luke led a pretty uneventful life up until he bumped into Obiwan, I guess.

Interesting questions though. Probably more interesting than I found Episode 1 to be. I dont think you can take away from a good movie overall. I think Episode 4 and 5 will continue to stand on their own as fine works.

[gooseUK]

Not forgetting the weird jump to 70's style haircuts right bang in the middle of the series!

[FaustBos]

Originally posted by gooseUK
Not forgetting the weird jump to 70's style haircuts right bang in the middle of the series! So the empire went retro :-) big deal hehehe.

Besides, we are talking a number of years in the SW timeline so i'm sure fads come and go. But with the miracle of CGI, im sure GL can take care of that for us.

[Morton]

Originally posted by Garry Cowell
Just watch them in the order they were released! :rolleyes:

Fair enough, but I meant for someone not familiar with Star Wars films, viewing them for the first time. They're not going to put a disclaimer on the box saying **Watch in this order**.

Although, granted, there aren't many people out there at the moment who won't have seen any of the films but there will be in the future.

Originally posted by FaustBos
Afterall, Luke led a pretty uneventful life up until he bumped into Obiwan, I guess.


I often felt sorry for Luke, I mean, he ends up dumped on a Desert Planet while his sister lives it up as a Princess!:p Still, guess jealousy isn't somthing that concerns a Jedi. :D

[FaustBos]

Originally posted by Morton
I often felt sorry for Luke, I mean, he ends up dumped on a Desert Planet while his sister lives it up as a Princess!:p Still, guess jealousy isn't somthing that concerns a Jedi. :D

That actually might make an interesting story. Though if I remember my "history" right, the kids were hidden from anakin, though it was never clear to me if they both were or just the girl. I always took that Vader realized that Luke was his son, not that he knew he was all along. He was using the force, ya know.

So it is interesting that one ends up ruler of a world and the other desert trash :-) hehe. Probably to keep one in obscurity and the other one in politics I would guess.

Jim

[Arch Stanton]

I have a simler problem with people watching 'Holiday on the Buses' before watching 'On the Buses.'

[RichB]

While working my way the excellent Episode One Dvd I got thinking

But with the miracle of CGI, im sure GL can take care of that for us

I weep for your kind
:D

[Xenole]

Morton, Wasn't Luke jealous of all his friends though, who were going off to do things whilst he had to stay and help out during the harvest.......?

[APPRIA40WR]

Star Wars IV, V, VI. Are they spoiled?

A bit plus I <u>hate</u> having to refer to them as 4,5 & 6.

Lucas, you are a genuine dickhead.

[Gozer]

Originally posted by APPRIA40WR
Star Wars IV, V, VI. Are they spoiled?

A bit plus I <u>hate</u> having to refer to them as 4,5 & 6.

Lucas, you are a genuine dickhead.

Yup, what really gets me though is that Lucas had 15 odd years to write episode 1. Surely he could have done better. Another thing is Obi-Wan in Empire says he was taught by Yoda yet in Ep1 he is taught by Qui-Gon?

[McD]

Originally posted by Gozer


Another thing is Obi-Wan in Empire says he was taught by Yoda yet in Ep1 he is taught by Qui-Gon?

There are literally hundreds of errors in the films. As it's been pointed out, in Ep IV (sorry APPR) C3PO doesn't know where he is, but he was born and brought up (you know what I mean) in Tattoine!

Anyway, I'm in the sad position of having viewed the Episode I DVD in its entirety followed by the original trilogy on video, once in Spec Ed form, another in the originals. (too much spare time on my hands)

And it's full of continuity errors! The new end of Ep VI that Lucas created shows celebrations in Tattoine after the fall of the Empire. Now, despite the fact that the news will have taken weeks to get there, that is a system controlled by the Huttes (as we are told) and bog all to do with the Empire. So why the celebrations??

From watching the films in both forms, and the little making-ofs that precede them, I've come to the conclusion that Rick McCallum is to Star Wars what Yoko Ono was to The Beatles. Lucas has too much power to be blameless, but I dont think McCallum has a clue. He's on a power trip, digitising everything in sight, and even using Don King's barber to complete the effect.

The best score Lucas can hope for is 5 out of 6 now! But I reckon he's going to have to settle for 3 out of 6. And to think Empire (magazine, not the Galactic one) said that Phantom Menace bested Return of The Jedi by a mile!!! Watch 'em back to back and you'll realise it's one of Empire's biggest ever review gaffes (which might even outnumber the Star Wars ones)!

Oh, and Mark Hammill is absolutely terrific in ROTJ. The entire emotional impact of the film rested on his shoulders and the boy did well.

[feverpitch96]

Originally posted by Arch Stanton
I have a simler problem with people watching 'Holiday on the Buses' before watching 'On the Buses.'

:D

[Xenole]

I would love to know who exactly gets invited to the preview showings of these movies (the ones where opinions are given so things can be changed), as they certainly didn't bother with Ep1.

[McD]

Originally posted by Xenole
I would love to know who exactly gets invited to the preview showings of these movies (the ones where opinions are given so things can be changed), as they certainly didn't bother with Ep1.

They did, hard as that is to believe, and considerable changes were made (well, in the editing room). Input by Spielberg and Ron Howard led to Lucas completely changing the sequence of the last third of the movie. Originally the Darth Maul, Queens Escape and Anakin's space ship adventure were to be played out on their own with no intercutting. That would have allowed viewers to enjoy Darth Maul in one go, without having to sit with a finger constantly on the forward button!

It was too late for John Williams to rescore, so his music was also re-edited much to his horror and he vetoed an isolated score track on DVD, feeling his music had been ruined during this part of the film. He's already started on II though.

[Davester]

I don't view TPM as a star wars film. I have the first 3 on vid and offcial vcd and will buy teh dvd. i willshow my kids the first three and ignore the recent rubbish. Hope they don't make a mess of Indiana Jones too.:rolleyes: :(

[SithLordSi]

Two things: firstly, about the celebrations on Tattoine at the end of ROJ: SE...these are surely due to Leia slaying Jabba the Hutt? That's what I thought, anyway.

OK, now my view on the new movies...well, we've only seen 1 out of 3, remember, so there's hope for them yet. Generally, however, I don't believe they will ever reach the brilliance of the original trilogy. However, I don't think this will ruin the older movies - sure, the link between them all is a little tenuous, but I'm not sure I'd want to view them all back to back anyway. Seriously, just watching the originals now, having seen Episode I, gives a greater emotional impact for me. When II and III are complete also, watching ANY of the six movies on its own will be a better experience, I think. So Episode I wasn't the best movie ever - so what, it wasn't THAT bad. And the fact that it adds to my understanding of the Star Wars universe is why I like it. Plain and simple. :D

Si

[Morton]

Originally posted by Xenole
Morton, Wasn't Luke jealous of all his friends though, who were going off to do things whilst he had to stay and help out during the harvest.......?

Ah yes. However, this was before Luke had begun his Jedi training and before he knew he had a sister who'd been living the life of Riley. :D

Originally posted by Gozer


Another thing is Obi-Wan in Empire says he was taught by Yoda yet in Ep1 he is taught by Qui-Gon?

In Ep1 their is a piece of dialogue, either within the film or the commentary, that basically says Yoda would have taught Anakin until he was a certain age and then the remainder of the training would be passed to another Jedi for completion. Qui-Gon is requesting that this initial stage, with Yoda, is skipped.

So, I assumed that Yoda was involved with the initial training of all Jedi.

BTW; Are we ever given an indication of how many Jedi there actually is/was?

[robbiejm]

Originally posted by McD
There are literally hundreds of errors in the films. As it's been pointed out, in Ep IV (sorry APPR) C3PO doesn't know where he is, but he was born and brought up (you know what I mean) in Tattoine!

I watched Episode 4 yesterday for the 1st time in about 3 years, and wondered why Obi Wan didn't recognise C3 PO and R2-D2, and I've just been looking at explanations on Star Wars sites:

Found this: http://www.theforce.net/swtc/tpm/tpmcont.html

'Some reviewers have complained about the fact that R2-D2 and C-3PO are familiar with characters such as Obi-Wan Kenobi and Anakin Skywalker in The Phantom Menace yet seem not to know them in the classic trilogy. This is an unfair criticism, based on a needlessly narrow interpretation of the older movies.

Firstly, it is impossible for audiences to understand most of what R2-D2 says in the movies, unless another character like C-3PO interprets or responds to his remarks. There were numerous instances when R2-D2 made lengthy comments that may actually recall events from the prequels era. For instance, he had many words for General Kenobi when they met again in the Jundland Wastes, but Kenobi had good reason to conceal their previous acquaintance. Artoo also demonstrated a burst of excitement (and perhaps recognition) upon sighting Anakin's lightsabre, when Kenobi presented it to the younger Skywalker.

C-3PO is a protocol droid and is programmed for keeping confidential information. In his early conversations with Luke Skywalker, his treatment of the subject of Princess Leia was downright evasive until key facts were exposed in the presence of General Kenobi. When Obi-Wan began to tell Luke a tale about Anakin and the Jedi, Threepio requested to be shut down, presumably to avoid facing hurtful memories about his Maker's tragic fate. (However the supposedly inert droid could be seen moving slightly; so he must have been eavesdropping!) Finally, at the end of the radio play of Return of the Jedi, which is an extension of the movie's footage, C-3PO joined Luke Skywalker at his father's funeral pyre, in acknowledgement and commemoration.

There are other reasonable explanations for why neither of the droids recognised Kenobi when they met in A New Hope. C-3PO might never have met Kenobi before; they didn't meet in The Phantom Menace and this situation might continue into the later prequels for all we know. Kenobi never paid much attention to R2-D2 either, and they were only present together suring a few brief scenes when the focus of attention was on other people or circumstances. Furthermore, by the time of A New Hope Kenobi had aged by at least twenty years since his last possible encounter with the companions of Anakin, including the droids. Kenobi may have eventually recognised the astromech, and his remark about never "owning a droid" could be a wry private joke. On the part of Artoo, knowledge of Kenobi might have contributed to his zeal to find the old Jedi.

If the droids knew the secrets of Anakin, they weren't promted to reveal or act upon their knowledge in the late episodes. Neither droid came close to Lord Vader. R2-D2 was separated from the Skywalker confrontation at Bespin by a closing door; C-3PO was dismembered, in Chewbacca's care and faced backwards when he was in Vader's presence on Cloud City.

On the other hand, it is possible that they didn't know all of the vital secrets. Artoo was Naboo royal property, and presumably ended up with Queen Amidala. Both droids were deposited in the royal court of Alderaan with Anakin's secret daughter. Therefore the droids might have been absent from the scenes of Anakin's transformation: although Lord Vader surely knows the droids, the droids need not necessarily recognise Vader wearing a mask. Vader had no chance to show recognition for R2-D2, and he might not have cared enough to expose himself to C-3PO at Bespin. (However the fact that he allowed C-3PO's parts to be delivered to Chewbacca's cell for repair could be interpreted as an act of mercy.)

C-3PO ought to have remembered his earlier experiences on Tatooine after landing there again in A New Hope. He did seem unfamiliar with the Dune Sea crash site, but this may have something to do with the unusually desolate area; his prequel-era travels might have only covered the rockier, more inhabitable regions. Perhaps he genuinely was unsure of his location: it may be that the galaxy containes other habitable double-sun desert worlds which look similar to Tatooine at ground level. Perhaps the lowly droids aboard the Tantive 4 were not told their destination, and there may be other worlds in the galaxy that resemble Tatooine. C-3PO told Luke Skywalker that he wasn't "sure which planet" he was on, but that might have been a philosophical evasion, like his exagerrated uncertainty about the identity of Princess Leia. He certainly has plenty of reasons to evade discussion of the circumstances of his creation and creator, even if he wasn't under some obligation, command or inclination to passively protect the security of Anakin's daughter.

At the start of Return of the Jedi, C-3PO remarked to his partner about the fearsome stories he'd heard about Jabba the Hutt. This is another piece of evidence suggesting that his memory is intact back to the days of his construction in The Phantom Menace. He implies that R2-D2 wasn't present when the tales of Jabba were told. Threepio most likely accumulated the gossip during his long stay on Tatooine before Anakin's fall. Jabba's influence and notoriety is concentrated on this remote desert planet, whereas Threepio's later service at royal courts and among rebels would have deprived him of access to underworld lore.

In A New Hope there is a corollary to C-3PO's knowledge of the underworld. He told Owen Lars that his "first job was programming binary load lifters, [which are] very similar to your vaporators." This recollection of work amongst heavy machinery is not consistent with the typical diplomatic usage of protocol droids, but it is suggestive of the environment in which he was left at the end of The Phantom Menace.

More recent evidence conclusively disproves the "mind-wipe" theories, at least with regard to C-3PO. In Dark Horse Comics' online preview of Union, C-3PO declares that "I first met the Groom, Master Luke Skywalker, on Tatooine, the planet of my birth." Therefore he does retain a memory of his origins, and presumably carries in confidence many tales of the prequel era.

C-3PO is proven to be tactful and secretive. R2-D2 is generally unintelligible to anyone except C-3PO. Both droids are common models, and the human characters they dealt with in the prequel era had been wounded or aged beyond recognition by the time Luke Skywalker's adventures began. These two facts explain all of the would-be discontinuities. There is no need to suppose that either droid has ever suffered a memory-wipe anytime within the span of the movies, as some commentators suggest.

There is one definite point of awkwardness in the continuity surrounding C-3PO. Books and the C-3PO CCG game card published before The Phantom Menace stated that he was manufactured 112 years before A New Hope. Since The Phantom Menace is much more recent than that, these references are disproven unless the droid is less than entirely Anakin Skywalker's creation. Perhaps the chassis and whatever part of the droid contains his sapience were found in a dismembered state, and Anakin carried out a restoration process using other droid parts. The Episode I: Visual Dictionary states that the structural framework was eighty years old during The Phantom Menace. Since the droid is recognised as a distinct model in the later movies, Anakin must have been performing an act of restoration, not complete innovation or invention.

Asides:
In an interview with EMPIRE magazine, coinciding with the release of The Phantom Menace in Great Britain, George Lucas has indicated that the perceived problem of the droids' recognition/non-recognition of Tatooine is actually trivial and will be clarified in later movie episides.

[FaustBos]

what a load of rubbish.

[FaustBos]

Originally posted by RichB
But with the miracle of CGI, im sure GL can take care of that for us

I weep for your kind
:D


hehe, i hope you realize this was said tounge and cheek. I hate to have my name associated with such a mis quote :-)

Also, as for the Lukas team getting it right in episode 2 and 3, im not holding my breath. its not that I dont believe the story could be enjoyable, but that I think Lukas has lost touch with his talent for making a movie. If CGI was effective, i'd be all for it, but it simply isn't when it accounts for the majority of a film.

As for Williams score... well, I understand that he is upset about its editing, but I do think that the score overall is a bit too much in the film. I dont think there was a single moment in the movie that wasn't accompanied by some sort of score, loud music, or loud noise. Its one of my bigger complaints about the movie, and even GL makes a joke about it in the Extras. (by the way, you can send in and get the special Enhanced Edition of the extras now, the technology has finally caught and the Extras can now realize GL's vision).

Jim

[01keith]

The six Movie box set will be excellent and I think it will have the same effect with people who haven't seen it. Our generation already knows about what will happen in Episode II And III, it's was like that in episode I with the pod race, I was sitting there thinking, I wonder who's going to win this then. It's obverse because Gi-Gon needs to win for the spaceship parts.
People seeing it without knowing the story though will be exicted by all 6 films and the next generation (no Trek Pun intended) will enjoy these films as we've done.

:clap:

[robbiejm]

Originally posted by FaustBos


Also, as for the Lukas team getting it right in episode 2 and 3, im not holding my breath. its not that I dont believe the story could be enjoyable, but that I think Lukas has lost touch with his talent for making a movie. If CGI was effective, i'd be all for it, but it simply isn't when it accounts for the majority of a film.


Yep, CGI is just lazy film making for the most part. A lot of the effects in EP4,5,6 look better than those in EP1 simply because physical objects were being filmed, rather than crappy computer generated 'trickery'. The Jawa's transport thing in EP4 looks superb, and all the scenes, particularly the desert ones are real, rather than just 'blue screen'.

If only Lucas had started these movies years ago before geeks and their little computers took over 'special effects'. EP2 & EP3 will be better than EP1 but they'll still be hollow soul less creations when compared with the timeless originals.

[robbiejm]

Originally posted by McD
From watching the films in both forms, and the little making-ofs that precede them, I've come to the conclusion that Rick McCallum is to Star Wars what Yoko Ono was to The Beatles. Lucas has too much power to be blameless, but I dont think McCallum has a clue. He's on a power trip, digitising everything in sight, and even using Don King's barber to complete the effect.


You've hit the nail on the head there, Rick McCallum is an arse.

From http://www.theforce.net/rouser/reviews/ldtrilogy.shtml

'But my favorite line was from our friend Rick McCallum, who proclaims that the original storytelling in STAR WARS was "compromised" by the antiquated special effects techniques

'Antiquated' are they? - then why do they look better than the effects in your film you stupid $$***&%%%%!.

I ran a search to see why Gary Kurtz didn't want to be involved and found this:

http://cgi.theforce.net/theforce/tfn.cgi?storyID=2624

'When the time came to produce ROTJ, Kurtz was unhappy with the story direction Lucas was taking. He felt that it was too much of a rehash of the first films with no real challenges. At the same time, Jim Henson was inviting him to produce his experimental film, Dark Crystal, which he chose instead.

Kurtz gave TPM a mixed review as he was clouded by plans made for Episode 1 back in the early 70s. As someone involved with Star Wars from the initial concepts, Kurtz revealed the original intentions for the nine films as they were laid out BEFORE 1980. Very interesting.

EPISODE 1: Was to focus on the origins of the Jedi Knights and how they are initiated and trained
EPISODE 2: Introduction and development of Obi-Wan Kenobi
EPISODE 3: Introduction and life of Vader
EPISODE 4: There were seven different drafts of the film. At one point, they pursued buying the rights to Hidden Fortress because of the strong similarities. At one point, Luke was a female, Han was Luke's brother, Luke's father was the one in prison (interesting point for some debates) and the film featured 40 wookies
EPISODE 5: Once written, the screenplay of Empire is almost exactly what is seen on screen. The only cut scenes were those involving wampas in the rebel base (cut because of time and unsolved technical glitches) and about two minutes of Luke/Yoda Jedi training with no real dialog.
EPISODE 6: Leia was to be elected "Queen of her people" leaving her isolated. Han was to die. Luke confronted Vader and went on with his life alone. Leia was not to be Luke's sister.
EPISODE 7: Third trilogy was to focus on Luke's life as a Jedi, with very few details planned out.
EPISODE 8: Luke's sister (not Leia) appears from another part of the galaxy.
EPISODE 9: First appearance of the Emperor.

Sounds to me that Kurtz was quality control. :)

[hookbeak]

Does anyone else think it a bit dumb to hide Luke on the same planet Anakin was born and keep him with the same Skywalker name living in/near the same town where Anakin lived ?

I can see many good reasons whi Obi-wan was never allowed to run the witness protection program again....

[JamesK]

I don't see how you can say he has in any way spoilt the films IV, V, VI by making the ones that were intended to come before it.

I also don't see how anyone can justifiably say that the effects in thoe films are better than the effects in SW TPM. The battle between the Gungans and the battle droid is an effect thousands of times better than anything I can recall in the original trilogy.

Its like people who comjplain about the 'new definition' or whatever of the force.

This definition happens in THE FIRST FILM in the series. Just cos you watched them backwards doesn't mean the first ones are bad. Thats like watching Hannibal and then Silence of The Lambs and complaining that SOTL explains why Hannibal was not in prison in the first place...:( :(

[robbiejm]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by jamesking420
I also don't see how anyone can justifiably say that the effects in thoe films are better than the effects in SW TPM. The battle between the Gungans and the battle droid is an effect thousands of times better than anything I can recall in the original trilogy.
[/QUOTE

Some of that particular scene is good, but it still contains one of the most irritating characters ever!. In fact, a whole 'kin army of the damn things. Compare it to the opening of The Empire Strikes Back and it pales into insignificance. The EP1 battle looks nice on the eyes....sometimes, but it's still like watching a computer game.

Lets not forget the underwater scene in TPM, which lets face it, is a thousand times worse than anything in EP4, 5 and 6. ;)

[John Walker]

McD: From watching the films in both forms, and the little making-ofs that precede them, I've come to the conclusion that Rick McCallum is to Star Wars what Yoko Ono was to The Beatles.

Finally! Someone else who feels the same way as me!!

Is it a strange co-incidence that every film of Lucas's that Gary Kurtz produced is excellent: American Graffitti, Star Wars, Empire Strikes Back. Then when they have a tiff and Lucas dumps him they all go s#!t: Return of the Jedi, The 'Special Editions' (some parts good, others bad) and finally The Phantom Menace!

Remember: There was never a sequel planned for A New Hope, believe it or not. The 'Episode 4' tag-line was only added in 1981 on Empire's release! Kurtz and Lucas put together one of the best sequels of all time: Empire Strikes Back, and set the story up for a total of 9 episodes.

Lucas then made Indiana Jones with Speilberg and decided to scrap the 9 episode plan and make the 'action-based' Return of the Jedi' to sum everything up.

Throw the cool darkness of Empire out the window: Bring in the cute, marketable Ewoks. Make Luke and Leia brother and sister (wha??). And instead of coming up with a good NEW idea for the Empire, rehash the first one and put a two on the end: Death Star II!

Up pops Kurtz: "No f#!cking way!! That's the worst idea I've ever heard!"

Lucas: "You're fired."

Kurtz: "Oh, bugger."

The original ending of Episode 6 had Han Solo killed off during the final battle (something Harrison Ford unsuccessfully tried to make Lucas do anyway), Princess Leia returning to her people (a la Queen Amidala) and Luke going back to Yoda to become a PROPER Jedi (instead of the pseudo one he had become after a few days with Yoda).

The Emperor was not meant to show up until Episode 9... the ultimate ending!

To think that Return of the Jedi/Episode 6+ may well have been as good as Empire if Kurtz had has his way.

Doh! :(

Gary Kurtz - Selected Filmography

Return to Oz (1985) (executive producer)
Dark Crystal, The (1982) (producer)
Star Wars: Episode V - The Empire Strikes Back (1980) (producer)
Star Wars (1977) (producer)
... aka Star Wars: Episode IV: A New Hope (1977) (USA: new title)

See a certain dark consistency?

Rick McCallum - Selected Filmography

"Young Indiana Jones Chronicles, The" (1992) TV Series (producer)
Castaway (1987) (producer)
"Singing Detective, The" (1986) (TV mini)
Pennies from Heaven (1981)

Should this guy really be in control of the Star Wars universe?

Who knows.

~ John

PS - Midi-chlorians... what the hell is that?? Every kid growing up after seeing Star Wars wanted to be Luke Skywalker. It was a positive tale that if even a lowly farmer's son could become a Jedi Knight... anyone could! We all had that ability inside of us... the potential to become one with The Force!

Oh wait a mintue, my doctor says my midi-chlorian level is too low. Look like I'm going to be stuck being a farmer's son forever. Bugger.

What kind of rat-assed religion is based upon a medical test??

"Sorry, we can't let you into the church, you're too fat."

[Gozer]

Gotta agree about the effects in Ep1, CGI looks too fake and unreal. ROTJ had, in my opinion, the best SP/FX in any film to date. They're perfect.

The orginal story arc that Gary Kurtz planned with Lucas sounds a lot more interesting than the @@@@e Lucas came up with on his own. Watching the Ep1 DVD doco's it want quote summed the entire film up. It was by McCallum saying that his job was to do put what 'George' wanted on the screen!!!, what the hells that about? Surely its his job to make a good film? and offer input/advice/criticism? Lucas has no self control, you can tell by the amount of blue screen and CGI used, someone like Kurtz was needed to keep him in check and stop him @@@@ing up one of the best saga of films ever made. Not that Ep1 was an awful film, it was just not Star Wars. Everything was shiny, new and perfect! Even though in all books and stuff I've read Lucas says he was trying to create a used unniverse.

Lets just hope Ep2 is in keeping with the dark atmosphere that was developed in Empire and all but scrapped in the neat little bundle that was Jedi.

:) :D :eek: :mad: :(

[Morton]

Originally posted by Gozer
Lucas has no self control, you can tell by the amount of blue screen and CGI used.


Blue screen/CGI are just tools, it was either that or get the hammer, nails and MDF out and have miriads of poor sods running around in rubber suits. I prefer the CGI character animation to that of say the Trade Federation guys with their poorly articulated mouths, even if you can see that's CGI. He wanted to produce environments that are simpy impossible to create in the real world.

Don't forget that Blue screen is also used so that they can add in the miniature buildings and ships that they did build, admittedly less than used in the Trilogy but still there nonetheless.

IMO most of the CGI settings blend in incredibly well, I'm not talking about the big city/planet wide shots but the scenes with actual actors such as the forests, the underwater chamber with the big boss, the Queens Chamber on Corusant and the Jedi council chamber. Whether they're CGI or plaster and chicken wire I don't really mind.

Originally posted by Gozer

Everything was shiny, new and perfect! Even though in all books and stuff I've read Lucas says he was trying to create a used unniverse.

:) :D :eek: :mad: :(

Do these books relate to Ep1? I think, from the doc's on the dvd, that the environments were meant to be 'fresher' as it represented a 'better' universe before the Empire started grinding it into the dirt.

[Gozer]

I know where your coming from, but Ep1 just doesn't feel right with me. Also during the dvd docos/commentary they made CG sets, like the Trade Federation control ship, that could have been made quite easily and would have looked less fake. I can understand the use of CG to make something that hasn't been seen before, but it was used everywhere. The original trilogy created new worlds fine without all this eye candy.

[Morton]

Originally posted by Gozer
eye candy.

A problem with most LucasArt projects in recent years, the majority of games using the Star Wars licence have been hollow affairs, no gameplay just great visuals/sound. Definitely a trend that needs stopped.