DVD-A and SACD question

[zantarous]

Simple question, do I need to have an amp that can handle high resolution sound to get the most out of DVD-A and SACD or is using 6 channel analogue out put from my DVD player (Pioneer 656) doing all the work?

The multi channel stuff sounds good but it just doesn’t seem to sound any better then normal CD quality wise.

[Radiohead]

What speakers are you using - these are a hugely important element with mult-channel sound...

[zantarous]

A set of satellite speakers with a sub

[Me Too]

Originally posted by zantarous
or is using 6 channel analogue out put from my DVD player (Pioneer 656) doing all the work?

My understanding is that most DVD players respect the "protected" flag and will not output the digital signal for DVD-A tracks. As such the DVD player is doing all the decoding work to it's analogue outputs.

[Squirrel God]

As Me Too says, you need to use the analogue outputs from your DVD-A/SACD player to your amp/receiver to get the high-resolution audio, unless you're using iLink.

The bandwidth capability of your cables, amp/receiver, and speakers will all make a difference to the quality of DVD-A/SACD output, but you'd have to go some to really maximise all three with current hardware and the quality of each individual component (especially how well it reproduces detail) will be more of a factor.

Depending on your equipment, you may find the DTS/DD5.1 soundtrack on a DVD-A sounds best.

[Me Too]

When I had cables long enough to use DVD-A :cry: :cry: :cry: my reference album was The Doors: LA Woman. The "Riders on the Storm" track blew away the DTS and DD tracks. Huge amounts more detail and bite :) Subtle differences on the R.E.M. albums though - but considering the source not bad :)

[Radiohead]

Originally posted by zantarous
A set of satellite speakers with a sub

That doesn't tell us a lot really - they could be £100 or £5000.

[Keiron99]

My own experience of SACD and DVDA - albeit limited to demonstrations in shops/shows etc, is that whilst the multi channel stuff is good, in terms of absolute fidelity compared to bog standard CD, it's not the quantum leap the marketing men would have us believe.

I recall about 20 years ago just after the launch of CD there was a big experiment conducted by a magazine. They had a group of "experienced" listeners sat in one room and in a connecting room, they played recordings of string music on a CD player and live music from artists channelled through the highest quality mics and amps into the speakers in the connecting room. The listenening panel had to decide whether they were listening to the real thing or the CD player. I think you can guess the conclusion - they couldn't reliably tell the difference between the two.

Still, doesn't stop me wanting a SACD player!

[RoyJones]

Originally posted by Keiron99
My own experience of SACD and DVDA - albeit limited to demonstrations in shops/shows etc, is that whilst the multi channel stuff is good, in terms of absolute fidelity compared to bog standard CD, it's not the quantum leap the marketing men would have us believe.

I recall about 20 years ago just after the launch of CD there was a big experiment conducted by a magazine. They had a group of "experienced" listeners sat in one room and in a connecting room, they played recordings of string music on a CD player and live music from artists channelled through the highest quality mics and amps into the speakers in the connecting room. The listenening panel had to decide whether they were listening to the real thing or the CD player. I think you can guess the conclusion - they couldn't reliably tell the difference between the two.

Still, doesn't stop me wanting a SACD player!



I can't help thinking the experienced listeners where either 3 years old or my wife with her friends, CD , although much better now, 20 years ago was generally cold and cluttered. I used to do tests with vinyl, and the vinyl always came out on top, much richer and warmer with much better space between the musicians, CD's are good in cars and on the move they would never compare to live musicians, shame!

[DB2k]

Its nothing to do with whatever this "protected " flag is.. coax or optical cannot transfer enough data for an amp to decode to analogue audio. Also, a normal amp doesnt have the necessary codec hardware to decode DVD-A anyway.

As for the experiment, I could tell a decent DVD-A from a CD any day. I;ve got a few albums on CD and DVD-A and the DVD-A ones are just so much cleaner and warmer. CDs sound a lot more well.. cropped for want of a better word, in comparisson.

Going back to the original question.. any amp wil lbe able to play DVD-Audio as the dvdp layer does the decoding. However obviosly a betteramplifier will amplify the input to a better level. You do not need a special amp for DVD-Audio. Are you sure you are playing the DVD-Audio soundtrack, instead of the Dolby Digital soundtrack that all DVD-As have? Might be worth checking. If you are using the digital output from your dvd player to your amp, then you aint listening to dvd audio..

[zantarous]

As I stated in my original post, I am using the 6 phono out puts on the amp and player, and I have my player set to DVD-A in the menu and this only gives the option of High Resolution Surround or 2.0 Stereo.

If I change the player setting to DVD-Video only then do I get the option of choosing 5.1 DD or DTS. And I have to say that the DTS version seems to sound better. So I will have to chalk it up to the amp not being all that good. The surround aspect still sounds good though.

[Radiohead]

None of which helps us as you still haven't said what the amp and speakers are.

:oh-hum:

[lardyl]

Here's my two penny worth: - not at all impressed with the SACD performance of my Pioneer-565, my old Arcam alpha CD player beats it for richness and presence and overall listenability on the 3 dual layer discs I have. (it was cheap so I'm not complaining...)
However, the DVD-A seems superior with all the five albums I have in that format sounding pretty good - I find that the surround option adds something to the stereo image (if that makes sense) as it helps to place the instruments/artists...
Anyway I recakon that some DVD-A discs may sound better on DD or DTS as "it is recommended that full range equally matched speakers are used for all five of the main channels with an extended low range sub-woofer for the LFE channel..." Indeed some discs have no LFE there and with my sub/sats there is quite a lot of the mix missing...forced to go for DD/DTS or advanced resolution stereo.
I agree with some of the comments from the reviewers on this site:
http://www.highfidelityreview.com/reviews/dvdaudio.asp
Good site with some technical info in amongst the reviews...
:dork: :o ;)

Ha,ha now purchased the AE Aegis speaker pack and now were cookin'..........:D :D :D :D :D

[mickl]

Originally posted by zantarous
High Resolution Surround

that's what DVD-A is

a DVD-A disc usually contains high res multi channel and stereo mix on the same disc along with the DD 5.1 and DTS tracks.

[chachi]

I thought a DVD-Audio disc was playable either in 2 channel or in DVD-A 5.1 out the analogues, didnt know DVD-A could also be passed in DD/DTS mode across the fibre/coaxial digital route as well ...

Hmmm ... but if I read the Panasonic site correctly they state the e55 has DVD-A playback but does not seem to have 5.1 rca breakouts :confused:

[kiran_mk2]

Originally posted by chachi
I thought a DVD-Audio disc was playable either in 2 channel or in DVD-A 5.1 out the analogues, didnt know DVD-A could also be passed in DD/DTS mode across the fibre/coaxial digital route as well ...

It's the same as hybrid SACDs (one layer SACD, the second regular CD) - it's so people without DVD-A players can still listen to the discs on a regular DVD player (allbeit in lower quality DD/DTS). If DVD-A ever becomes mainstream, expect these options to disappear.

[chachi]

Originally posted by kiran_mk2
It's the same as hybrid SACDs (one layer SACD, the second regular CD) - it's so people without DVD-A players can still listen to the discs on a regular DVD player (allbeit in lower quality DD/DTS). If DVD-A ever becomes mainstream, expect these options to disappear.

:doh: so in summation, REAL DVD-Audio is only passable via analogue RCAs and not coaxial/fibre optic under any circumstances. (am a bit amazed that fibre optic is insufficient bandwidth though)