Help from those with PJ knowledge!!!

[captainshadwell]

HI all,

Heres the deal. I have a new house with largeish living room of 4.8m by 4.3m and a spare £1200 or so.

Current HC system is denon 3802 amp, mission m74 fronts, 77c centre and single set of 7ds rears, phillips 32pw9306 tv, pioneer 340 dvd all connected with cable talk 3.1. The room can be layed out any way I want but here is my dilemma.

I basically wanna buy a new pj and after some reading Im a tad confused. All the talk on screendoor, chicken wire, throw distance and so on I cant really work out which pj I should go for.

I was thinking Sanyo Z1 and a new harmon kardon 25 but through confusion wasnt then sure which would be better. To go for a Sanyo Z1 and HK25, or possibly Infocus X1 or Panny ae300 and then choice of HK25, upgading pc to use as HCPC or any other prog scan player. I then read there are some problems with the falgging on the HK25 and this stops the prog scan which I believe is bad as its the best PQ.

Anyway, if anyone has any info they would liek to add or if all is answered elsewhere please feel free to tell me. Ive had a gander at the avforums but doesnt seem to be an introduction to PJ's.

Thanks for any replies.

Oh and last thing incase it makes a difference - -the majority of the use would be for dvd though I have an xbox and sky which I would like to put in as well.

Cheers

CS

[Baz]

Ive an ae200 which I use through component outputs onto a cream coloured wall. No progressive scan, however I have heard it does imrove things no end.

I would say that no matter which one you go for you WILL be amazed at what you get. A 8' image is something to behold. I sit about 13' away from the screen and don't see any chicken wire at all, but I did in the old room where I was only 9' away.

By the way I think screendoor and chicken wire are the same, i.e. the ability to actually see the pixels making up the picture, its easier to make out on bright whites such as sky pans etc. component leads do help reduce the problem no end and the distance away from the screen.

The PJ is sat above my head at around 13' and throws an image of 116" diagonal.

I also have sky hooked up through RGB scart which means the PJ and digibox are sat next to each other, I couldn't for the life of me work out how to connect the two together being 13' apart, the only option I could find was a 10m scart lead which would look silly drapped across the room. RGB sky is nowhere near as good as component DVD but it is acceptable. And composite looks terrible over 10m on such a big image.

As for throw distance you really need to have the PJ hooked up and be able to move it around the room to see how big the image will be. The manufacturers do give throw distances in the booklet but theres more to consider such as height of the picture etc. Its easier just to move it around. Then you need to decide where to put it, i.e on a coffee table or on the ceiling, ceiling is better as it keeps it out the way but it will have to protrude down into the room about 5"-10" so in a living room it may be a bit intrusive. Your room sounds on the border on being able to place the PJ near a wall so it may end up having to be near the centre of the room, you may want a larger throw distance than the Pannasonic, however not to long as the picture would be smaller.

Anyway I can't help you choose your pj but whatever you go for you will love having a PJ the quality is much better than I ever expected, and your setup sounds fine to benefit the big screen size.

It is confusing isn't it. :)

[Woz]

You'll be needing to project onto the wall at first, as you haven't included a screen in your budget, and these can be surprisingly expensive. Obviously wall colour will be a factor here. If you have magnolia walls, you'll probably get away with it, but this will also make the room lighter and can effect black levels on the projected image. My room is magnolia as it's our living room and we can't have it dark and gloomy. I don't find it a problem at all, but I'm certain I'd be castigated for it over on the AV Forums.

The amount you're willing to spend is probably enough to get you a Z2 rather than a Z1, which has a higher resolution and is a superb machine (I've got one :) so I'm biased).

I would say, that for the most discrete installs (and a happy other half if you have one) you need to PLAN. It took me ages to actually plan where the kit was going and hiding the wires was a major part of that. Projector Central has a very good throw distance calculator, so you can work out where you will need to have your projector for the size of screen you require.
I think the sitting distance should be around 1.5 times the width of the screen to give you the best image (far enough away to not see screen door, but still close enough to get the impact of a large screen).

If you look at DLP projectors (not sure if there are any in your budget range) look out for the rainbow effect. This is not a problem on LCD projectors, but the advantage of DLP is better contrast and black levels.....they tend to be more expensive though. I suffered quite badly from the rainbows when I saw one, and so they were excluded from my list of possibles. Bear in mind that even if you're not susceptible to them, people who you invite to see a movie might be.


Erm....sorry, I seem to have just put a collection of random thoughts down!

Here's my install : http://homepage.ntlworld.com/warren.alexander/ht/ht.html

[captainshadwell]

Cheers both for your comments..........both helped quite a bit.

I took a look at your pics Warren and noticed you have the tv and pj on same wall - - out of curiosity how tall is your wall, etc as this is the type of thing I would be looking for but thought the screen for the pj would be too high for viewing. Also, what have you got connected up to the pj and where is the wiring? Also, if you dont mind, what are the measurements - pj to screen, pj to dvd player, etc for the wiring.

In regards to the budget, Im allowing at first for a prog scan dvd/upgraded hcpc and the pj. I will project onto the wall initially as its light enough but will eventually make a fixed screen or buy a motorised.

I think main thing with the pj is like you said - -you need to plan it through - work out what needs connecting and where they will go and see where the pj itself needs to go and so on.

Any further thoughts would be appreciated.

Muchos

CS

[Mr. Wilby]

I would go for a Z2 as well over any of the other budget models. I've got a Yamaha LPX-500 which has the same panel resolution as the Z2 and its really quite impressive.

Coupled with a DVD player that can output a DVI image (e.g. a brainwave, or then a HTPC) and you'll be on to a winner.

[morph]

2nd the Z2 as well

My friend has one. As well as for films - plugging in a PC, even with some "old" classic games AvP2, Xwing Alliance is a whole new experience

[captainshadwell]

Well that was the other dilemma - should I buy a prog scan dvd player such as the harmon kardon 25 or upgarde the pc? Current spec is athlon 2200, GF4Ti4800se, 512 333mhz ram, sound blaster 5.1 with live drive and a hacked pioneer 104 - also have a samsung dvd drive that is unhacked.

What type of spec and sofware would be needed for a good HCPC?

Ill be looking to connect sky, dvd, xbox to the pj but would like to still have them attached to the tv so that I dont have to use the PJ all the time - anyone know where you can get a long lead for the xbox so i can link it up to the tv/pj and my denon 3802?

Cheers for all the help and advice.......

CS

[Woz]

Originally posted by captainshadwell
I took a look at your pics Warren and noticed you have the tv and pj on same wall - -

out of curiosity how tall is your wall

Wall height : 234cm
telly height, including stand : 93cm

Originally posted by captainshadwell

, etc as this is the type of thing I would be looking for but thought the screen for the pj would be too high for viewing.


We watch the PJ with the screen lowered to just above the level of the top of the telly (the screen has a black section at the top to allow for this). It's just at the right height, and personally I wouldn't want it any lower even with no obstructions.

Originally posted by captainshadwell

Also, what have you got connected up to the pj and where is the wiring?

The wiring was one of the biggest nightmares!
I've got every port on the pj wired up, even though they aren't all currently in use.
Component : DVD player
Composite : TiVo (although this will be changing very soon to use a VGA to RGB adapter as the composite picture looks terrible at that size).
SVideo : not currently used.
VGA from the DVI port - see above.

The wiring is hidden behind the coving, in the ceiling and walls!

Originally posted by captainshadwell

Also, if you dont mind, what are the measurements - pj to screen, pj to dvd player, etc for the wiring.


PJ to screen - as best as I can measure it's between 290 to 295cm
PJ to DVD player.....well, all my kit is in the wooden hifi cabinet you see in the picture by the telly. I needed (irritatingly) about an 11m run, so I'm using 15m cables, bought from the place listed on my web site. Picture on component is stunning, so I don't think this run is anywhere near too long.

Originally posted by captainshadwell

In regards to the budget, Im allowing at first for a prog scan dvd/upgraded hcpc and the pj. I will project onto the wall initially as its light enough but will eventually make a fixed screen or buy a motorised.

I think main thing with the pj is like you said - -you need to plan it through - work out what needs connecting and where they will go and see where the pj itself needs to go and so on.

Any further thoughts would be appreciated.

Muchos

CS

I went with the screen and PJ first.
I'm not sure about the htpc option as it's a bit of a techy option and my wife and kids wouldn't be able to use it. Although I would have thought that your PC is well up to the spec required for HTPC. You'd just need to stick in a DVI enabled graphics card. You'd also need it either in the living room or within wiring distance, so consider noise in this as well.
I must admit that I'm looking at the prog scan player option now though, as although the picture is truly amazing, I do notice 'tearing' on some discs.

I'd certainly recommend a leccy screen. My mate has a (I think) draper luma manual and he leaves in down all the time. I suspect that this may be the reason that he has noticable ripples on his already, where mine is still flat. The pull handle is in the middle, and I would have thought that pulling a manual up and down would put more strain on the centre of the screen than the outer edges. Also - with a leccy screen you're more likely to keep it retracted, so it won't develop ripples over time (I hope!).

Any more questions, as away.

Bear in mind that this is my first PJ, and although I did some auditioning, the only other PJ I've spent time with is my mate's one - an Epson TW200, which is considerably more expensive than the Z2...although I personally think there is not much between them picture wise.

[captainshadwell]

Well what can I say - the good man answers all - cheers Warren.

The only other question I have which you may not be able to answer is where can I buy a lead long enough to go from the xbox to the PJ with sound splitting off to the amp?

Thanks again for all the answers, quite a big help. All I need to do now is plan a bit and go buy the gear and Im sorted.

Thanks to all the above.

CS

[Woz]

Originally posted by captainshadwell

The only other question I have which you may not be able to answer is where can I buy a lead long enough to go from the xbox to the PJ with sound splitting off to the amp?



Depends on what you run from the Xbox.
You could go composite :gag: ,Svideo or component :thumbs:

I've just bought the hidef kit from dvdboxoffice (free pastage).
This will give you standard component out on an unmodded UK xbox (I messed up the flash on my xbox, so for the time being it can be considered unmodded :( ). You cannot get progressive scan or hidef output on a standard xbox (google will tell you how to go about achieving this if required).

You may want to think about your options with the xbox though. It can play dvds quite well I'm told and erm...skirting around the issue....can do quite a nice job of progressive scan dvds at high resolution too. The problem is that if you want to run an xbox as well as a DVD player, you might end up needing a component video switch...which are hard to come by and currently cost the earth. It's a problem I'm looking at for once I fix my xbox. At the moment I switch the leads over, which is less than satisfactory.

(another option with the Z2 is that it will in fact support a component in on the DVI port as well with the correct adaptor. Which is nice. I'm using this for VGA at the moment, and may use it for DVI if I get a dvd player that supports it, but the cable runs are limited on DVI. I understand that 7.5 metres is the spec. Erm - did that make sense? Basically, the DVI port on the z2 also has an analogue section (DVI-I) and so you can in fact run two sets of component cables to the Z2.....)

Cripes, I'm wordy today aren't I? :D

[captainshadwell]

Yep I have a modded xbox with X2Lite so looks like the High def av kit may be way forward first - - Ill see what its like for the dvds for prog scan and take it from there.

Cheers Warren yet again.

CS